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Source code of ASP.NET

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Re: Source code of ASP.NET

#101
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Uninspired rails port" is a far cry from accurate. I've worked with both rails and asp.net mvc. I started with rails in the 1.x days but also had clients that used .net. I despised web forms for a variety of reasons so I jumped on the mvc bandwagon as soon as the fist community preview was released. Hack, Connery, Hanselman, & Guthrie openly acknowledge that rails was a source of inspiration in their book http://www…

They also filled it up to the edge with Ruby-like magic all over the place. ASP.NET MVC is the only place I've ever seen in mainstream compiled languages where the code can break in untraceable ways if you change the name of a method parameter (f.ex. for controller actions). Or where models suddenly don't get data because you forget to add "{get; set;}" to the code somewhere. Absolutely no way to find out why it went…

> Sure, you can learn this and then not make the mistake again, but the reason I don't use Ruby or Python much anymore is because I've had with with having to spend a full day going through a framework's source code to find out why my bug is a bug. In an ecosystem and language like C#, you expect things to either work or to get a pretty OK error message, preferably at compile time.

No, that's what you expect. I expect that the traits of frameworks you describe to be features of particular frameworks and to be largely independent of language, except that in languages that don't provide introspection/metaprogramming facilities that enable them, you probably won't find them (probably, because usually there may be elaborate ways of hacking around language limitations to do magic, and then even examining the source code will make the magic less obvious.)

You can easily have magic-free frameworks in Ruby or Python, and easily heavy-magic frameworks in most (mostly) statically-typed compiled languages like C# and friends as long as they have some introspection/metaprogramming facilities (and optional dynamic typing like C# makes this more viable, too.)

If you want to choose a language so as to avoid any need to examine the traits of particular frameworks so that you don't run into a heavy-magic one, you are going to need a much more limited language than C#.

> What's the point of using a compiled language if half your code is a dynamic viewbag of string keys and liberal JSON parsers that just ignore fields it doesn't expect or can't fill?

The point is the other half of the code. (The part that, in Python or Ruby you might be tempted to drop down to a C or Java [for JRuby] extension to do.)

Re: Source code of ASP.NET

#102
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without Linux it's surely doomed. PS. I heard 2015 will be the year of Linux

"PS. I heard 2015 will be the year of Linux" I heard that too in 2012[0], 2013 [1] and 2014 [2] [0] http://www.linuxtoday.com/it_management/2012010900341OSOO [1] http://www.finnbay.com/linus-torvalds-leadership-defines-201... [2] http://meshedinsights.com/2014/03/14/2014-year-of-the-linux-...

I know, that's the joke ;) (and it goes waaay further back than 2012...)

Re: Source code of ASP.NET

#103
post #94

But why are they looking if their code runs on Mono [1] ? [1] https://github.com/aspnet/FileSystem/blob/dev/src/Microsoft....

http://www.hanselman.com/blog/IntroducingASPNETVNext.aspx "... Oh, and by the way

ASP.NET vNext (and Rosyln) runs on Mono, on both Mac and Linux today. While Mono isn't a project from Microsoft, we'll collaborate with the Mono team, plus Mono will be added to our test matrix. It's our aspiration that it 'just work.'"

Thanks for pointing that out though, I learned something new today! http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd642331(v=vs.110).a...

Re: Source code of ASP.NET

#104
post #67
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Most users of .NET is in the enterprise (as opposed to tech and startups) and Java has positioned itself as the go-to platform for big data analytics and processing. I think this comes down to clinging to an antiquated product model. A lot of the technologies that are seeing rapid adoption are open source and driven by transparent communities. In some cases companies back them (e.g. cloudera, datastax, 10gen, ty…

And where exactly do you think most devs work? As far as startups go, and we may be usual, but we are a healthcare analytics company using Sql Server for medium? data and processing, with a pretty light .Net middleware/front-end.

Yes this might be true right now, but take a look at a lot of the tech startups are cropping up - humor yourself and look up a list of the tech ipos the last two years. They are overwhelmingly based on open source technology and they are also displacing or disrupting your traditional 'enterprise' businesses.

Even though C# and .NET has a huge developer following, .NET is losing ground to OSS within the top traffic driving sites. 10 years ago, people would build their MVP in .NET because it was the best technology around, but nowadays I see more people building new businesses and placing their strategic technology bets elsewhere (Java/Python/Ruby or Node).

A lot of these developers don't want to be married to the Windows eco-system, for a variety of reasons. Microsoft cannot continue to thrive on the sole basis of it being the only game in town anymore. So all in all what I'm trying to say is I don't think the long-term prospect is looking great.

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