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Neovim's Next Feature Poll

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Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#61

Post by justinmk »

threatofrain wrote: post #8

I've heard from a HN commentator that Neovim has given up on its principle goal of refactoring, and that progress has largely been due to uncrustify. Can anyone else speak to the health of the project?

I wonder where that rumor started, but I responded to a similar assertion on reddit[1].

To summarize:

* Uncrustify was literally one of the first things that was done before Neovim was even announced. It's only listed in the "progress" page for completeness and reference.

* The refactoring is ongoing and is moving along smoothly.

* Job control ("async") is committed, and it works. You can use it today.

[1] http://www.reddit.com/r/vim/comments/23xgxv/tim_pope_is_flir...

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#62

Post by weaksauce »

prawks wrote: post #45
weaksauce wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Editing the same thing in different places at the same time.

If it's the same thing, find & replace? Just playing devil's advocate, I've never come across a situation where I wanted multiple cursors that sed or macros couldn't do for me.

I don't particularly need or use the feature over block selection or find and replace but it's similar to an interactive find and replace where you don't need to edit every instance of the found term. Some people love it.

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#63

Post by rat87 »

I feel like one of the main goals of neovim is to make it more like emacs. Or guile emacs.

Instead of a shitty language for plugins and configuration: vimL (with some support for plugins in alternative languages but not well integrated and not present in all vim installations) and replace it with a good interface to a single language. Like emacs. Much of emacs is written in elisp instead of c, I wonder if this will enable quicker/higher level development with lua for parts of neovim.

The plans for a compatibility interpreter for vimL on top lua sound a lot like the elisp on top of guile plan for guile emacs, and isn't one of guile emacs goals to add support for concurrency?

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#64

Post by scott_s »

[deleted] wrote: post #59
chroma wrote: post #35

I am convinced that Vim's greatest asset and risk is Bram Moolenar. Bram is a talented, experienced developer, and I commend him for creating Vim. But he is the only person with write access to Vim's codebase. The primary author of NeoVim is Thiago de Arruda. Thiago tried to work with Bram, but was rejected.[1] Patches similar to Thiago's have been proposed before, but were also rejected.[2] It is for this reason tha…

[deleted]

Based on the results of his labor: he produced a stable piece of software that millions rely on every day. Myself included.

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#65

Post by lubomir »

exDM69 wrote: post #30
MetaCosm wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bram has said very little. He, IMHO, massively underestimates the communities desire to contribute... Neovim simply tapped in to a community desperate to improve a project they love, and finding no good options on howto do so. As for "getting behind it if it succeeds" lets hope not! I was a financial supporter of Neovim. I also have run the #vim channel on FreeNode for over a decade. They serve different goals. Neovi…

> Neovim is where "big changes" can happen, gut legacy support, move fast, break shit. It is on Github, it has multiple people doing major contributions, it is being re-factored to make it easier for MORE people to get involved. Neovim wants to be a huge community project, which is awesome. The first thing done to Neovim was to re-format all the code and then do some refactoring that breaks things. You can't make an…

I do not know how much manual labor it is, but there are some pull request with merge of vim patches, so it definitely is possible (or at least someone thinks it is worth their time).

E.g. https://github.com/neovim/neovim/pull/653

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#66

Post by xutopia »

[deleted] wrote: post #59
chroma wrote: post #35

I am convinced that Vim's greatest asset and risk is Bram Moolenar. Bram is a talented, experienced developer, and I commend him for creating Vim. But he is the only person with write access to Vim's codebase. The primary author of NeoVim is Thiago de Arruda. Thiago tried to work with Bram, but was rejected.[1] Patches similar to Thiago's have been proposed before, but were also rejected.[2] It is for this reason tha…

[deleted]

He's being diplomatic. Why should you put someone down who has one of the most installed text editors out there?

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#68

Post by scott_s »

[deleted] wrote: post #67
scott_s wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on the results of his labor: he produced a stable piece of software that millions rely on every day. Myself included.

[deleted]

That is not the results of his labor. That is the means by which he achieves those results. There is an enormous difference. You're assessing the technical state of his project, and confusing that with its actual impact on the world. They are two different things.

I call him a "talented developer" because he has successfully developed and maintained (for two decades) a stable piece of software that is the base infrastructure on millions (billions?) of computer systems around the world. Millions of other developers rely on his work for their own work. I'll grant that maybe he has done this despite his engineering skills. But his software is a success by any reasonable measure, and I think it takes talent to achieve that.

I love code. I get an enormous pleasure of well engineered code. I appreciate code for its own sake. But code also serves a purpose, and I refuse to believe that someone whose code is so enormously successful somehow did so by accident, without talent.

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#69

Post by chunkstuntman »

edanm wrote: post #54
hk__2 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What problems can you solve with multi-cursors that you can’t with actual features like block selection?

Simple (very common example): .some-css-rule { padding-left:50px; padding-right:50px; } Say I want to edit those two numbers. With multi-cursors, it's as simple as select one number, hitting a button that causes the other number to be selected, then writing the new value. Now, after I wrote it, I realize I forgot to put a space after the colon, and want to change the formatting. No problem - I just make the change to…

If you do this kind of editing daily, then executing the following commands would become second nature

:s/50/60/g

:s/:/: /g

No need to touch the mouse or use macros. Many use-cases for multiple cursors are satisfied by the core functionality of vim, however they may not be immediately obvious.

Re: Neovim's Next Feature Poll

#70

Post by bilalq »

Morgawr wrote: post #56
edanm wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Macros and global replace are substitutes, sure, but they're not at all the same thing . And while I'm no vim wizard, I have used it as my main editor for 4+ years, and have a 1500 line vimrc and plenty of plugins (including my own), so you don't get to assume I don't grok the vim way of thinking :) I've heard the "macros is the same" sentiment many times, and usually it's from people who have never had much experien…

>In fact, many of the people arguing against multi-cursors have been convinced after trying them that they are better. Fact by who? >The basic problem with macros and global replace is that they don't happen immediately and don't give you feedback. I don't know any vim user who hasn't had the distinct pleasure of needing 3 tries to record a macro before they got it right. True about macros, which are a very powerful…

Just to add to that, you can also use visual block mode to change text on multiple lines. You get a lot of the benefits of multiple cursors that way while still doing things in a more traditional "vim-like" way.
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