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A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

research.microsoft.com

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Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#101

Post by xerophtye »

finnh wrote: post #94
userbinator wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> people can disagree about "move the camera" vs. "move the paper" - but pinch-to-zoom-in is wrong in all contexts. It's not wrong, it's just another manner of perspective: "shrink the aperture" vs. "shrink the paper". > how did these people not notice that they implemented pinch-to-zoom backward from how it works on their phones? On a touchscreen, it feels like you're actually working with the content directly, but…

Sure, there is a model that can explain it. Same w/ camera-vs-paper in swipe. By "wrong" I mean "does not work that way in any other device, and so violates the user's by-now-fairly-well-burned-in expectation". So, in terms of the principle of least surprise, wrong. Wilfully so, given that (to my knowledge at least) pinch-to-zoom has only existed for a few years and has only worked in this one way.

I am guessing its configurable (like inverted camera in games) So, that should end this debate right now.

Btw, two finger scrolling on trackpads is usually opposite of what works on the phone too, and people have no trouble with that either

But ignore that, as i said, it must be configurable. No sense on debating on each others preferences

Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#102

Post by xerophtye »

bennyg wrote: post #16
dnlserrano wrote: post #12

It reminded me a lot of Apple's Magic Mouse: https://www.apple.com/magicmouse/ I did not enjoy working with it, one of the few times I had to use a Mac to do something. However, I think these new forms of interaction will definitely play an important role in the way we will use (mechanical) interfaces in the future. A bit off-topic, but have you seen this? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/mimu/mimu-glove-for-mus.…

I absolutely love using my Magic Mouse. Whenever I get on someone else's computer I'm trying to go back and forth on web pages and desktops with the mouse.

the sideway scorlling seems like the only worthwhile addition to me, other than that, i kinda like the feel of physical buttons and scroll wheel under my fingertips

Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#103

Post by kamkazemoose »

xerophtye wrote: post #100
ndesaulniers wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using the tracpad on an Macbook Pro, I don't usually find myself clicking, but mostly using gestures such as tapping. Even two finger tapping is recognized. I don't see why one of the crazy gestures this cool thing can recognize couldn't represent what we currently think of left click and another for right.

well yes, most of us tap instead of clicking. question is, how would it differentiate a "tap" from a "keypress" if trackpad and keyboard are in the same place?

you could do some other gesture, like raising two fingers? We are trained to tap now, but people can figure out different gestures like pinch to zoom so I don't think the clicking has to necessarily be a tapping gesture

Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#105

Post by tomkin »

Gotta say, not sure why some are shitting on MS on this one. Whether you like the keyboard or not, it shows that MS isn't all business and fuckups. Sometimes it's a smart idea, or one leading to an innovation.

Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#106

Post by rch »

cgs1019 wrote: post #80
rch wrote: post #67

I rigged one of these up with a theremin and a laptop back in 2007.

I always wanted to try this! I imagined having two antennae, though, positioned orthogonally to give a 2-d signal.

I used an old SWTP kit that had horizontal plates instead of antennae, but could still generally resolve 2-d movement.

Some details and images of what I started with:

http://www.theremin.us/144/144.htm

Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#107

Post by bertil »

runawaybottle wrote: post #46
dchichkov wrote: post #43

Brilliant! Not sure I like that particular implementation (with IR), but the idea of having the whole desktop keyboard work like a giant track pad is an enticing one. Can a track pad surface be integrated into every keyboard key?

What's wrong with the IR implementation? I guess they could introduce capacitive sensors as well, but I'd imagine IR + capacitive sensing would only make it more accurate. IR makes sense mainly because there has to be a simple way to know that you're trying to type and not trying to move around the mouse/gesturing. Soon as your fingers are a certain height off the keyboard, it can know you're not typing. Otherwise yo…

> What's wrong with the IR implementation?

Not sure how that would work in practice, but I personally work with a cup of tea between my hands most of the time. That could interfere. Leap Motion was popular some time ago, and it detected the cup as such, not something bigger. I don’t know if they used IR though.

As you said, when interpreting non-obvious outputs of probes, several detection elements presumably help interpret issues: say pressure, conductivity for trackpads. I believe ‘Moves’ (the app recently bought by Facebook) use both the phone cell-tower signal to triangulate location and the motion to correct the occasional jump to the next neighbourhood when the nearest tower is suddenly busy.

For that ‘virtual trackpad’, using several frequencies or motion sensors might help; I’m not a big fan of your suggestion of a button: it seems… cumbersome, but it might actually work. I was made to realise today how I unconsciously used three- to four-button keystrokes most of the time.

Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#108

Post by drothlis »

guelo wrote: post #26

The idea of turning the surface of the keyboard into a trackpad is very cool, you could almost get rid of the mouse. Except for, how do you click the mouse pointer? Accidental clicks of keyboard keys is probably what makes it impractical.

With the old fingerworks touch-pad keyboards[1] single-finger taps were for pressing keys, two-finger movements moved the mouse cursor and two-finger taps were for clicks. It worked really well. The main annoyance was the lack of feedback when typing, a problem which this Microsoft version solves! If the gesture & tap recognition is sufficiently good. Fingerworks went on to be acquired by Apple and its technology was incorporated into the first iPhone.

[1] https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=fingerworks&tbm=isch

Re: A Motion-Sensing Keyboard

#109

Post by m_mueller »

melling wrote: post #69
m_mueller wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather than removing functionality of already crammed laptop keyboards, I rather think this will be used to get rid of the touchpad and allow smaller laptop form factors that still have full sized keyboards, e.g. new kinds of surface devices.

The ESC key, and all the function keys, on my Mac laptop are half height keys. Personally, I'd rather just have an ESC gesture, for example.

Replace one key with a gesture - ok. Replace all the 12 F keys and their secondary functions with 24 gestures - no thanks.
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