The CEOs should have gone to jail for this. They literally conspired against honest workers.
Well, at least one of the CEOs is dead.
Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
91–100 of 109 posts
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#92Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah, pretty terrible outcome. Lawyers get a huge chunk of money for relatively little effort, the actual plaintiffs get like a couple of thousand each, and the companies pay out an amount that is likely far less than the amount they saved by the illegal collusion and is also not sufficiently punitive to impact their future decisions to do similar things.
do the individual plaintiffs have any say, in aggregate? surely there has to be a better way to pursue a class action than this.
Sort of -- the class was certified under Rule 23(b)(3) which is not mandatory, however it is opt-out rather than opt-in. The opt-out procedure is not particularly straightforward either. Class settlements have fallen apart do to opt-outs, but as far as I know, never in a case with such a large class.
There will be a hearing where a judge will have to approve the settlement, theoretically that is how the fundamental conflict of interest between class counsel and their nominal clients is assuaged, but in practice Federal District Court judges rarely reject settlements.
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#93Earlier quoted context omitted.
The lawyers, who are fronting the money to pursue this, have to balance risk and reward. Anything can happen when it's put before a jury, including a deadlock from one recalcitrant juror followed by a retrial. Getting to that point would be insanely expensive, likely years of discovery battles, deposition taking and all that (and Jobs, the apparent ringleader, is of course beyond mortal questioning and judgement). Th…
But who's risk and reward is being considered when the clients end up with very little? If the result was such a pittance for the people affected by the actions, why bother in the first place? If the result isn't going to be punitive to the companies then what's stopping them from doing it again in the future?
It's somewhat punitive.
Even if they're not technically admitting guilt, paying that much money is taken as guilt by pretty much everyone. Don't know if Apple has taken reputational damage, but the damage to "Don't be evil" Google is severe for a lot of people where it can make a difference.
As for what's going to stop them, a recidivist is treated worse in the courts. They're now under the terms of a DOJ consent decree; violating those will in theory be bad for them (it gets political, of course). The path of another class action civil suit like this would likely be much worse. Etc.
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#94I'm really getting tired of the slaps on the wrist these giant corporations are getting for their bad behavior. A few years ago Verizon was fined something like $23 million for bilking their customers out of money. That is literally pocket change for a company that size. It didn't punish them one bit. This is just continuing proof that there is no difference between corporations and the government. One writes the law…
You do realize that you could start a corporation if you wanted to?
You clearly missed the point here.
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#95Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do you really want to work for a company ran by criminals? Why aren't Jonathan Rosemberg and Eric Schmidt in jail? Fuck them and fuck the entire legal team at Google! Disclaimer: I work for Google.
Is this sarcasm or a troll? If it's neither then I'm confused by your statement that you work for Google yet imply that working for Google is morally wrong.
I presume he has plans to do something about that (working for Google).
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#96Earlier quoted context omitted.
posts about his autoadmit and carleton adventures: http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=306628 http://autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2372636 wikipedia sockpuppets: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Isomorphic/Minions_of_the_... blatant sockpuppetry on quora: http://qr.ae/rPxvn http://qr.ae/rPxCq his obsessive anti-google and anti-startup posting on hackernews speaks for itself.
I don't know what autoadmit is all about, but it seems like a juvenile, abusive, bullying community. Why do you care enough to have these links on hand?
i browse both hackernews and autoadmit. the links were merely a google search away. did you read them? they describe a pattern of posting and sockpuppetry that can also be seen in his contributions to wikipedia.
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#97I'm really getting tired of the slaps on the wrist these giant corporations are getting for their bad behavior. A few years ago Verizon was fined something like $23 million for bilking their customers out of money. That is literally pocket change for a company that size. It didn't punish them one bit. This is just continuing proof that there is no difference between corporations and the government. One writes the law…
You do realize that you could start a corporation if you wanted to?
Ok, lets say I do start a corporation. And I do all the right things and in 5-10 years its doing several hundred billion dollars in revenue. Not unheard of - Apple, Google, Facebook.
And lets further say that with all that cash I decide I need to get my own representation in government because its just not efficient to donate the max to my representatives in Congress. So I hire a lobbying firm and/or set up a PAC or two to pressure other representatives who otherwise wouldn't give me the time of day because I'm not a constituent.
Now I'm basically (and, in fact, outright) saying to them, "I gave you $x,xxx,xxx.xx in contributions[1] so I want you to pass these laws. I've written them for you so you don't really even need to spend time reading them. Aren't I a nice guy?" And so the representatives pass the laws because I gave them a lot of money and all they really want is the power anyway.
Then, because I'm so big, I inevitably do something stupid (at best) or criminal. So I call up the aforementioned paid-for representatives and tell them to get me out of the hot water. They put some pressure on the right people and, Bob's your uncle, I'm paying the equivalent to three or four hours revenue in "fines".
THIS. IS. WRONG!
If that's not clear enough lets look at it from my standpoint as a citizen (or, you know; and ACTUAL person):
I make an average of $45,000 a year and can only contribute $2600 per candidate[2]. In reality I'm only able to contribute a fraction of that and probably don't even do that much. But lets say I do something stupid and/or criminal. What happens to me then? I go to jail AND I pay an ACTUAL fine that is a significantly higher percentage of the income I just lost by going to jail.
The people you vote for in this next election need your vote. But they won't be representing you. Because you don't have enough money. Google does though. And so does Apple. And so does Hollywood, Big-Pharma, Oil & Gas... The list goes on of organizations who are more important to your government than you.
1: Bribes
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#98There's something Apple and Google and their ilk are much more afraid of than this lawsuit and, based on these shenanigans, it may be time. I found out last March why my manager at Google was adverse to me. I knew someone was pulling strings on him and I had thought that he was taking orders related to my criticism of the G+ direction (in fact, the G+ executives were, as far as I know, innocent) but it was actually b…
Michael, I am convinced the way forward is to incorporate and (positively) subvert the system from within.
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#99There's something Apple and Google and their ilk are much more afraid of than this lawsuit and, based on these shenanigans, it may be time. I found out last March why my manager at Google was adverse to me. I knew someone was pulling strings on him and I had thought that he was taking orders related to my criticism of the G+ direction (in fact, the G+ executives were, as far as I know, innocent) but it was actually b…
You are describing a professional society, like doctors or lawyers have. Also: * transparency in compensation. * protection against sharing of individual HR data (salaries, performance reviews) among companies, often used to keep pay down. Those two things are in contradiction.
Re: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit
#100Earlier quoted context omitted.
But who's risk and reward is being considered when the clients end up with very little? If the result was such a pittance for the people affected by the actions, why bother in the first place? If the result isn't going to be punitive to the companies then what's stopping them from doing it again in the future?
It's somewhat punitive. Even if they're not technically admitting guilt, paying that much money is taken as guilt by pretty much everyone. Don't know if Apple has taken reputational damage, but the damage to "Don't be evil" Google is severe for a lot of people where it can make a difference. As for what's going to stop them, a recidivist is treated worse in the courts. They're now under the terms of a DOJ consent dec…
Well, whether repeating the practice will result in increased damages remains to be seen. I, for one, shall not hold my breath.
But future increased damages does nothing for victims in the present.