Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Do Men Suck At Friendship?

mensjournal.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

201–210 of 261 posts

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#201

Post by aestra »

Hasu wrote: post #122
adwn wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder when "America" ceased to mean "the two continents North and South America" and started to mean "USA" in the heads of US citizens. There's a reason why "European" isn't synonymous to "German", and why "Asian" isn't synonymous to "Chinese".

It's been going on since long before you were born. John Adams(our second President) called the United States "America" in his inaugural address. [1] We use "The Americas" to refer to the continents as a pair, and prepend a cardinal direction to refer to one of them individually. Citizens of the Commonwealth of Australia call themselves Australians, despite there being other governments on the continent of Australia.…

Many cultures consider "The Americas" to be one continent - America.

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#202

Post by aestra »

meric wrote: post #98
interpol_p wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author explicitly acknowledges that the traditional "girly" friendship may not be the optimal. And implies that male friendships can be deeper than shared activities without turning into such relationships: > At the same time, a wave of feminist sociologists and psychologists began describing female friendship, with all its confessional talk, as the optimal model. > Many feminist thinkers now see those views as o…

I'm uncomfortable with the idea that feminist thinkers should be an authority on male friendships, since by definition feminist thinkers think from the point of women, and here we are discussing friendships between men. I've a couple of female "friends"[1], and generally when talking to them I often feel all they're doing is telling me how right I am to feel in such and such way, frequently highlighting the differenc…

>since by definition feminist thinkers think from the point of women

Hrm? Many men are feminist.

Feminism is defined as "the belief that men and women should have equal rights and opportunities." Feminism also deals with men's interests when the inequalities benefit women (child custody for example)

>"following" my wife wherever she goes and agreeing with her every word

Good god. These are join decisions that are made mutually.

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#203

Post by aestra »

SoftwareMaven wrote: post #103

My formative years were somewhat less than ideal (moving every three months, abusive environment, fat before fat was normal, nerdy, etc). I always blamed not being able to make lasting relationships on that. I've now come to the conclusion that 80% of why I suck at friendship is innate, and 20% is learned. I've tried hobbies and meetups to no avail; I just wind up sitting in the corner. I think this is where the 20%…

This isn't so much innate. It is most likely an anxiety problem. You can overcome it but it isn't going to be easy as it takes going far out of your comfort zone.

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#204

Post by thelettere »

elohesra wrote: post #141

Has anyone actually read the studies linked by the author to back up his drivel? I'll save you some time: the 2007 study isn't valid even by the low levels of scientific burden required for psychological studies (it's entirely based on self-reporting), and the 1982 study support the opposite conclusion to the author's. In fact, the 1982 study [0] finds that men and women simply have different kinds of friendships, wh…

There are whole field of scientific study based almost entirely on self-reports. As such, there has been much research done on its veracity, which has shown that it is largely valid and reliable when reporting on simple things (like friendship behavior) so long as it's anonymous, does not require introspection(1), and there is no fear of reprisal(2).

The 2007 study meets all those requirements, so I see no scientific reason to question its results.

Also, I can't think of any practical methodology for studying friendship behaviorally - but would love to be proven wrong.

1. Baumeister, R. F., Vohs, K. D., & Funder, D. C. (2007). Psychology as the science of self-reports and finger movements: Whatever happened to actual behavior?. Perspectives on Psychological Science, 2(4), 396-403. Baumeister, R. F., Vohs, K. D., & Funder, D. C. (2007). http://users.business.uconn.edu/jgoodman/mgmt%206201%20assig...

2. Brener ND, Billy JOG, Grady WR. Assessment of factors affecting the validity of self-reported health-risk behavior among adolescents: evidence from the scientific literature. Journal of Adolescent Health 2003;33:436-457. Summary at http://www.minnetonka.k12.mn.us/TonkaCares/RwR/Documents/Val...

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#205

Post by ctdonath »

sanityinc wrote: post #186
adwn wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder when "America" ceased to mean "the two continents North and South America" and started to mean "USA" in the heads of US citizens. There's a reason why "European" isn't synonymous to "German", and why "Asian" isn't synonymous to "Chinese".

Do Canadians self-identify as living in "America"? I would guess not. But Germans certainly self-identify as European.

They equate "America" with "USA". "Canada", "America", and "Mexico" are located in "North America". And, BTW, "Mexico" is also in "Central America".

It's a cultural/linguistic norm, not a programming problem. Don't try to reason it out as rigorous logic.

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#206

Post by logn »

adwn wrote: post #97
colechristensen wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking of cringing, the adjective you're looking for is 'American'.

I wonder when "America" ceased to mean "the two continents North and South America" and started to mean "USA" in the heads of US citizens. There's a reason why "European" isn't synonymous to "German", and why "Asian" isn't synonymous to "Chinese".

"America" is short for "The United States of America". It's also the only shortened name which doesn't need to be preceded by 'the'. And it's the only single word which can be used to describe people of the US so then it's also been used to refer to the country. Originally 'American' was used to refer to people of British America, an area comprised of the eastern half of present-day US and Canada. Later the term came to refer to just the US.

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#207

Post by ThomPete »

thelettere wrote: post #204
elohesra wrote: post #141

Has anyone actually read the studies linked by the author to back up his drivel? I'll save you some time: the 2007 study isn't valid even by the low levels of scientific burden required for psychological studies (it's entirely based on self-reporting), and the 1982 study support the opposite conclusion to the author's. In fact, the 1982 study [0] finds that men and women simply have different kinds of friendships, wh…

There are whole field of scientific study based almost entirely on self-reports. As such, there has been much research done on its veracity, which has shown that it is largely valid and reliable when reporting on simple things (like friendship behavior) so long as it's anonymous, does not require introspection(1), and there is no fear of reprisal(2). The 2007 study meets all those requirements, so I see no scientific…

I am not sure I understand what you are claiming here?

Are you saying that self-reports (a.k.a. anecdotal evidence) has happened so often on this subject that it in itself has created a big enough dataset to label it a proper study?

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#208

Post by thaumasiotes »

jebus989 wrote: post #134
TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

United States of America = America United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland = Britain

I'd say "Britain" more commonly refers to Great Britain, not the UK (i.e. Britain == [England, Scotland, Wales, *islands]).

Speaking from a US perspective again, for me "the UK", "England", and "Britain" are all completely synonymous with each other.

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#209

Post by jfim »

mcmullen wrote: post #178
gabzuka wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mexico is actually considered part of North America as well

Well... TIL! (Though, rather obvious thinking about it...) It definitely screws up my generalisation. I thought "North American" would be nice given the U.S. and Canada generally share the same language and culture. Mexico messes with that, slightly. Though, I suppose states like Florida (from my Dexter knowledge) would have similar issues given the high-proportion of Spanish speakers. Speaking as a Brit, we do (rath…

The US and Canada do not really have the same language demographics. 56% of Canada speaks English as a native language, 21% speaks French and Spanish clocks in at 1.2%; in contrast, the US has 80% English, 12.4% Spanish and 0.45% French.

Re: Do Men Suck At Friendship?

#210

Post by eswat »

sanityinc wrote: post #186
adwn wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder when "America" ceased to mean "the two continents North and South America" and started to mean "USA" in the heads of US citizens. There's a reason why "European" isn't synonymous to "German", and why "Asian" isn't synonymous to "Chinese".

Do Canadians self-identify as living in "America"? I would guess not. But Germans certainly self-identify as European.

I do not. Maybe that would be different if I traveled to the US often. But despite some of our similarities I see Canada as distinctly Canada and I do not live in America (America’s Hat and Canada’s Pants jokes aside).
Post reply on HN