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Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

themoscowtimes.com

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Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#61

Post by mzs »

tokenadult wrote: post #57
jsumrall wrote: post #3

I'm not sure how to articulate it, but I find it immensely interesting that Snowden fled to Russia, while Pavel is fleeing from Russia, both for issues within similar realms.

Several comments at the same comment level as this comment seem to take seriously the assertion that Snowden only incidentally ended up in Russia. In fact, his route from Hawaii to Hong Kong (a territory controlled by the central government of China) and then on to Russia looks very suspicious to readers who know what airline flights connected at that time of year from Hawaii to other places. Moreover, Snowden had co…

Hong Kong was a good choice. It does not extradite to US or many countries friendly with US and has a slow moving legal system that is relatively independent compared to other options that meet the first criteria. It gave him a relatively safe place and time.

Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#63

Post by informatimago »

jsumrall wrote: post #3

I'm not sure how to articulate it, but I find it immensely interesting that Snowden fled to Russia, while Pavel is fleeing from Russia, both for issues within similar realms.

The point is that there's no place to flee to!

All oligarchs, all politicians, all countries are the same. This is prison planet, and nobody of memory has escaped yet ever.

(The fight against free energy is not so much as to keep the oil oligarchs powerful, as to prevent people to flee out of the planet).

Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#65

Post by aaronem »

ajuc wrote: post #59
piokuc wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you talking about? Can you be a bit more concrete and give a link or another reference to your "source"? You are changing subject of the discussion, derailing it into some allegations against "The West" and its past alleged wrongdoings against Russia, and you are praising Putin at the same time - that really smells like a nowadays Russian internet propaganda, there is so much of this on forums these days, th…

While I don't like what Russia is doing regarding civil rights and Ukraine - accusing the people you debate of being paid to tell lies is poor form and hurts the point you're trying to make. Especially because most people that support Putin do so not for money, but because they are Russian nationalists and consider Putin foreign policy a good idea. That's sad, and explains nicely why Russia couldn't transform into de…

I'd hate to think anyone misread me as speaking in support of Putin for any reason. To conclude, from my explanation of why people in Russia support Putin, that I must support Putin as well, strikes me as bearing the same relationship to the more ordinary jump to a desired conclusion, as an Olympic-class pole vault does to a bunny hop; further, if it's no longer possible for the average interlocutor to recognize the difference between explaining a position and supporting one, then I can only weep for the lost art of intellectual debate.

Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#66

Post by corin_ »

rosser wrote: post #21
melling wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so hard to understand? Hacker News has a lot of naive people who have no idea how the world works. Hey, the 80's called, and if you were born during or after, it's probably time to ask what you don't understand. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2014/03/...

You aren't exactly wrong, but being smug about it doesn't make for productive discourse.

Off-topic: apologies, clumsy fingers on my phone gave you a down-vote.

Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#67

Post by MisterWebz »

tokenadult wrote: post #57
jsumrall wrote: post #3

I'm not sure how to articulate it, but I find it immensely interesting that Snowden fled to Russia, while Pavel is fleeing from Russia, both for issues within similar realms.

Several comments at the same comment level as this comment seem to take seriously the assertion that Snowden only incidentally ended up in Russia. In fact, his route from Hawaii to Hong Kong (a territory controlled by the central government of China) and then on to Russia looks very suspicious to readers who know what airline flights connected at that time of year from Hawaii to other places. Moreover, Snowden had co…

Maybe my reading comprehension is failing me, but where exactly does the article say Snowden had contact with agents of the Russian government while he was still in Hong Kong?

Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#68

Post by piokuc »

ajuc wrote: post #59
piokuc wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you talking about? Can you be a bit more concrete and give a link or another reference to your "source"? You are changing subject of the discussion, derailing it into some allegations against "The West" and its past alleged wrongdoings against Russia, and you are praising Putin at the same time - that really smells like a nowadays Russian internet propaganda, there is so much of this on forums these days, th…

While I don't like what Russia is doing regarding civil rights and Ukraine - accusing the people you debate of being paid to tell lies is poor form and hurts the point you're trying to make. Especially because most people that support Putin do so not for money, but because they are Russian nationalists and consider Putin foreign policy a good idea. That's sad, and explains nicely why Russia couldn't transform into de…

Whether he is paid for his propaganda work or not, or just brainwashed and honestly believing in Putin I don't know; these are equally probable options, but they have the same cause: Putin's propaganda.

Anyway, it is well known, that Russia is spamming online forums with propaganda: http://stratrisks.com/geostrat/7796 Honestly, I've seen many, many comments like that under any article criticising Putin and Kremlin, and I feel like I can recognise common traits of these comments - apart from the message there is also the weird, even though often very sophisticated language... Many people do not know what's going on, though, that's why I decided to say something, and I don't care about down-votes.

Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#69

Post by tlogan »

aaronem wrote: post #53
piokuc wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds like shit, Putin-ordered propaganda to me: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_brigades . HN is not free from this, apparently.

Well, the source on which I'm relying most strongly here, especially for estimates of the death toll of the post-Soviet interregnum, is a newspaper whose American-expatriate writers were hounded out of Russia, shortly after Medvedev "succeeded" Putin to the presidency, over a single article satirizing one of "Medvedev's" new policies. I suppose you can argue that these events were merely part of an incredibly recondi…

I agree - in general this is the raise of Russian nationalism. It started in 1970s, then 1990s were really tough, now it is on the rise.

And democracy in Russia is not at all my concern (and concern of my friends here and there). If things continues like this, then after the western influence is removed, Uzbekis and others will be on the plate :( Then after all Uzbekis are gone, Armenians will need to move their patriarch to Moscow... and so on.

Re: Vkontakte Founder Flees Russia

#70

Post by aaronem »

piokuc wrote: post #68
ajuc wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I don't like what Russia is doing regarding civil rights and Ukraine - accusing the people you debate of being paid to tell lies is poor form and hurts the point you're trying to make. Especially because most people that support Putin do so not for money, but because they are Russian nationalists and consider Putin foreign policy a good idea. That's sad, and explains nicely why Russia couldn't transform into de…

Whether he is paid for his propaganda work or not, or just brainwashed and honestly believing in Putin I don't know; these are equally probable options, but they have the same cause: Putin's propaganda. Anyway, it is well known, that Russia is spamming online forums with propaganda: http://stratrisks.com/geostrat/7796 Honestly, I've seen many, many comments like that under any article criticising Putin and Kremlin, a…

So much for intellectual debate [1], then, I suppose. Congratulations, if you like, on having genuinely astounded me; perhaps it's merely foolish naïveté on my part, but I'd never have expected anyone to conclude that I am a traitor to my country, based merely on the facts that I know a little bit about modern history and that my English is better than yours.

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7630065

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