Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

news.ycombinator.com

61–70 of 293 posts

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#61

He's trying to fuck you over. Remind him that he works for you, not the other way around. Start looking for his replacement. Check with a lawyer about the security of your own stake and make sure you are good with the business guy, because the CTO has probably been whispering poison in his ear about you.

> .. the CTO has probably been whispering poison in his ear about you. This just has to be true.

FWIW, he may just have been saying exactly what the OP says himself:

"I have improved significantly in the last few months from where I was (generally unstructured development, no tests, poor formatting / naming etc., but functional, generally coding to working with others instead of by myself) but he has said that it's not enough.

We have hired another coder who I get along well with and I have learned from."

There's quite possibly a good argument to be made saying "this guy shouldn't have commit access to our code base" and it's not beyond the bounds of reasonableness to read into that "a few mid level developers under normal CTO oversight will give us a much better starting codebase than this guy is likely to deliver without significant extra training and experience".

Not saying that's definitely the case, but it's certainly plausible. (And I've seen it before, more than once... Hell, I've _been_ "that guy" myself, back in the day.)

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#62
If you are a founder:

- Are you needed?

   - yes: then stay.

   - no: Do founders hate me?

     - yes: get the legal stuff ready, leave with compensation.

     - no: Do you have future plans for contribution?

       - yes: then get to work!

       - no: Do you like your job?

         - yes: then get back to work, make contributions.

         - no: then why are you asking this question?

I also think that having a CTO does not mean there can't be a technical founder. You can find other things to do, such as build product roadmaps, and with basic technical understanding, you could make positive contributions, not through lines of code, but through the bigger picture.

Reading your post sounds like you don't have self confidence, but you got to find your edge! It doesn't have to be coding. There's more to a startup than lines of code, and if you were there since Day 1, you've already done much more for the company than the CTO. Feel better about yourself, and take a pivot on your perspectives.

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#63
post #54

> My question is, does he have a point? No. He is making the wrong assumption here "that he wouldn't hire me if I wasn't already a founder and not what the company needs". First you ARE a founder- I genuinely do not believe you can't learn the knowledge you needed given how motivated you are. And you are learning. Second, he already admit you are what the company needs (at least during this 3-6 months), so why is he…

Is this not like you build a house, hire someone to live with you since they can build/extend this house even bigger, then they tell you to get out of your own house? I still don't understand how someone he hired can throw him out of his company?

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#64
This is your company. Not the CTO's.

It's time to have a frank discussion with your co-founder and decide what is best for you and for the company.

It may ultimately be best for you to step down, but it shouldn't ever be because of your technical abilities, and it shouldn't be because the CTO believes you should.

There are lots of things you can be doing, and the fact that you CAN code (even if it's not high level) is huge.

There is testing, blogging, social networking posts, Google Analytics, SEO/SEM, recruiting, buying office supplies, soda runs, customer outreach, marketing, more testing, design, investor outreach, product management, program management.

You have so much that you can do, that unless you are a liability (past convictions by the SEC), or so caustic that you are the direct cause for the companies failures, that you still have an important role at your company for many years to come.

And if you do stay, it's time to put the CTO on notice, the CTO works for you.

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#65
You have phrased this as an almost apologetic post, focusing on your ability to write code. An analogy to medicine might be worrying about your ability to take a good history and physical exam, but in the meanwhile the patient is bleeding in front of you.

The problem is not your ability to write code - the CTO even admits as much when he says he needs you now but wants to replace you later. Your code is desperately needed. But I don't really care about this.

Assuming a normal situation, the company is yours and your co-founder's (by ownership), and the CTO likely has a small amount of equity (relative to yours). In an early stage company that hasn't yet raised money, your company is basically an extension of yourself. You don't have responsibilities to shareholders or employees because you don't have either yet. You have a responsibility to yourself and your vision. The CTO did not found the company and that alone tells you that you have some amount of vision, ability, or ability to take advantage of chance that he did not have.

If you want to remain involved in the company, and it seems that you do and should, then you need to clarify for the CTO where the boundaries of his responsibilities lie. His job is not to ask you to quit, and he may be beyond the point where you can continue working with him (or not - I don't know enough detail). But if he is to continue working for you (and do recall that he works for you at your pleasure), he needs to focus on solutions that don't involve him trying to fire you.

Most founders don't end up coding very much after their companies grow, and the CTO may be hopeful to get more experienced programmers working for the company. But there are about 10,000 miles in between "we should hire people with deep experience in X" and "I want you to leave the company." The latter is a political gambit that needs to be dealt with after careful consideration in a way that shows teeth.

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#66
post #2

First off, I'm sorry about your situation. Nobody here will be able to judge with any degree of accuracy whether he has a point. I personally would not look at this situation as a technical one; this is a business relationship situation. Regardless of whether there is any grain of truth, the CTO has lost confidence in you. Not just a little bit. He has asked you to leave. The rest of my advice assumes the CEO (your c…

Thank you for taking the time to respond. > The rest of my advice assumes the CEO (your co-founder) has quite a bit of confidence in the CTO. This is the case, it is in my interest however to remain in the company because my equity is vested, the sooner I leave the less I will get in return, apart from my time, and opportunity cost I invested all my personal wealth.

You need to sit down in a room with the CEO and CTO, and have the CTO describe his concerns and then you can all resolve the issue together. For the sake of the culture of the company you can not let this slide as back-room talk, as that would create a poisonous culture. When that is answered talk to a lawyer before signing any papers, and remember that the companys lawyers are obligated to protect the company and not your interests so really get your own laywer.

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#67
Make sure you've seen 'Startup.com' (documentary) and 'The Social Network' (useful for the archetypes even with the fictions). If you do wind up as an early founder out, try to be more like the guy in Startup.com, or Jawed Karim (YouTube), rather than Ron Wayne (Apple).

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#68
IMO, there is no point you try to improve your coding skill at this point of time. As a co-founder, you should try to improve on management skills, try to find replacement of your CTO and then fire him

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#69
Since he's not asking you to leave the company but instead to stop writing code, is there work to be done elsewhere in the company?

You might find this talk from Ian Hogarth (Songkick) at Hacker News London Meetup quite relevant. He talks about how he would fill a role at Songkick before getting a more specialised person in to fill that role which would see him moving to another completely separate role within the company which needed to be filled.

http://vimeo.com/59187050

Re: Ask HN: CTO wants me to leave

#70
First question I have. Do you at least have a double trigger in your stock agreement.

New CTO / Wants your out. Some stock option agreements have a double trigger where this can make you vest 100%. Make sure to look over it thoroughly.

Post reply on HN