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Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

www-cs-faculty.stanford.edu

71–80 of 187 posts

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#71
>> P.S. This is the second time in my life that I have written a letter to a U.S. government official. The first time was during the Vietnam war.

I wonder if he wrote it to Lyndon B. Johnson asking why he started the war in the first place or perhaps querying how much involvement he had in the Kennedy assassination.

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#72
post #13

Amazon is building a $600 million datacenter for the CIA. The CIA did all of the bad things listed in Dropbox article as directed by Bush and Condoleezza, and they are still actively trying to cover up torture. I've never heard anyone here not using EC2 over it? The tech scenes pitchfork mobs are wildly inconsistent. I have a feeling this one hit a nerve because Condoleezza Rice is famously hated across the internet…

The CIA is a big massive blob that represents thousands of people. Rice is an individual. Much easier to critique.

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#73

I don't understand what people are admiring here. This "letter" is nothing more than a meaningless rant by a person whose field of expertise has nothing to do with politics, economy, international relations or terrorism. Donald Knuth is a great computer scientist, but hearing him talking about international politics is like hearing any other random person on the street. Also: "...and that almost blindly supports Isra…

What do you find unserious in that statement about Israel?

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#74
post #13

Amazon is building a $600 million datacenter for the CIA. The CIA did all of the bad things listed in Dropbox article as directed by Bush and Condoleezza, and they are still actively trying to cover up torture. I've never heard anyone here not using EC2 over it? The tech scenes pitchfork mobs are wildly inconsistent. I have a feeling this one hit a nerve because Condoleezza Rice is famously hated across the internet…

Politicians should be held to extremely high moral standards, hence the outrage.

If you read the link you'll see that Knuth himself only wrote two letters to government officials. Most people do not have time to become full time activists, so a certain degree of inconsistency seems inevitable.

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#75
post #53

You lost me at almost blindly supports Israel's increasingly unjustifiable occupation . Why is it that people who know so much about one thing feel compelled to open their big mouths about something else they clearly know so little about?

Which part are you objecting about, the implication that the US blindly supports Israel, or the implication that Israel's occupations are unjustifiable?

Anybody who holds a simple one-sided opinion on Israel/Palestine is wrong, full-stop.

Criticizing US government officials for their excessive support of Israel is reasonable. Blanketing all of Israel's various incursions into Palestinian territory as "unjustifiable" is bad for the discussion and makes an otherwise-reasonable person look extremist.

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#76
post #13

Amazon is building a $600 million datacenter for the CIA. The CIA did all of the bad things listed in Dropbox article as directed by Bush and Condoleezza, and they are still actively trying to cover up torture. I've never heard anyone here not using EC2 over it? The tech scenes pitchfork mobs are wildly inconsistent. I have a feeling this one hit a nerve because Condoleezza Rice is famously hated across the internet…

This is a cover up to hide the real motivation: she is a woman and black, and none of you want her involved in a tech company. Disguise this all you want as opposition to the war or Bush or whatever. It is really opposition to her gender and race. This is how you do in silicon valley where blacks and women are considered token employees hire to look good. So make up stuff about her and move her out. Now you have your high-tech lynching hiding behind phony moral outrage.

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#77
post #13

Amazon is building a $600 million datacenter for the CIA. The CIA did all of the bad things listed in Dropbox article as directed by Bush and Condoleezza, and they are still actively trying to cover up torture. I've never heard anyone here not using EC2 over it? The tech scenes pitchfork mobs are wildly inconsistent. I have a feeling this one hit a nerve because Condoleezza Rice is famously hated across the internet…

It's quite simple. Rice and Eich are not directly useful and their dismissal would have no effect on the protestors, so there is almost zero sacrifice. There is no sacrifice necessary on behalf of the protestors. Dropping AWS on the other hand could be difficult and expensive for many, so protesting AWS requires either hypocrisy or sacrifice.

While I personally think Eich shouldn't have been CEO, you sum up Internet protests nicely: People will scream and moan, but only a fraction of those people would continue to do so if it required they actually do anything--even something as simple as moderate physical exertion.

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#78
post #47
post #13

Amazon is building a $600 million datacenter for the CIA. The CIA did all of the bad things listed in Dropbox article as directed by Bush and Condoleezza, and they are still actively trying to cover up torture. I've never heard anyone here not using EC2 over it? The tech scenes pitchfork mobs are wildly inconsistent. I have a feeling this one hit a nerve because Condoleezza Rice is famously hated across the internet…

And your point is what? That demonstrating outrage here is in some way invalid since similar outrage was not demonstrated in every other similar situation? Do I have no moral authority to speak up in this situation if I have not before? Maybe we should boycott Amazon. Not boycotting Dropbox because we didn't do the same for Amazon doesn't get us anywhere.

Yes. Selectively demonstrating a ridiculous amount of outrage at the hate target of the day is absurd. The fact that you couldn't possibly do it in every similar situation shows why it is absurd.

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wikileaks violated the AWS TOS by publishing classified material in violation of US law.

Feel free to downvote since it doesn't fit the meme that "information wants to be free", but the statement is 100% correct.

You sound really sure of yourself, yet cite nothing.

http://gigaom.com/2010/12/07/has-wikileaks-actually-done-any...

Re: Knuth: Open Letter to Condoleezza Rice (2002)

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure "inconsistently principled" == "consistently unprincipled".

I think that depends on the reading of "inconsistently principled". If the principles are inconsistent, then I tentatively think your equality holds. If the principles are consistent, and the stridency in application is inconsistent, then I don't think they are equal. With the second reading, a tangential concern is what drives the inconsistency. If it is purely stochastic, then I think the above saying holds ("bette…

Keeping it intellectual, these arguments get put in front of the US supreme court all the time. Under "uses and abuses" of power, type cases. Disregarding their fundamental import has important consequences (at least if you believe wikipedia). See, eg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Protection_Clause

There's also a long history in cognitive science on social trust and perceived consistency (anti-hypocrisy).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance

So that is why people normally vet these issues outsied of the context of SCOTUS, even on social issues. These are valid ideas irespective of people's views on any subject, IMHO.

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