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Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

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Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#31

Post by ben1040 »

bane wrote: post #10
supergeek133 wrote: post #6

I wish more companies had this mentality, it's amazing how much talent pool they are leaving out there by not allowing remote work for some positions. Especially for those of us that live in the Midwest but cannot leave for any number of reasons.

Honestly, the "right" way for companies to do it is to simple lease an office near a concentration of a few workers. Even if it's just 4 or 5 employees, a nice office with internet and a kitchen isn't very expensive. That way it's not "remote" work, it's just another corporate office location. Checking online in Kansas City, MO. 13,000 SF of office space runs < $10k/mo. That's a bargain. Spot checking other places (C…

Yep. I work in St Louis for a company based in Palo Alto. There's three of us working here out of a small office, and they were able to get a place for pretty cheap in a neighborhood with a lot going on. Our company's real estate manager is super big on finding us spaces that are close to lots of walkable things (for lunch, drinks after work, shopping, etc) and doesn't want people out in some suburban business park.

The team here in STL started out in late 2012 as one guy in a coworking space. I hired on eight months later. Another few months after that we picked up a third person and the company leased us a space, bought us video conferencing gear, gave us a budget for supplies and stocking the fridge, and has been super supportive of whatever else we might need.

I've been really happy with the whole arrangement. Collaborating over video conferencing and chat is pretty easy and I've rarely run into situations where I really felt out in left field. I've found that when I've visited the actual office, people have a fairly "heads-down, get your stuff done, and generally use asynchronous methods to bug people" work style anyway (and a lot of people prefer to work from home one or two days a week rather than ride Caltrain), which lends itself ok for remote teams.

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#32

Post by cwal37 »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #25
cwal37 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with your overall point of looking in the areas around DOE labs (disclaimer: I'm at one now and worked at a different one in the past), but maybe only half-ish of them are truly in nowheresville. I would say Idaho, Los Alamos, NETL, Pacific, and probably Ames definitely are; while Oak Ridge is kind of on the bubble. This might just be my bias having grown up in the Midwest. The rest are in major metropolitan…

Don't forget Fermi National Accelerator Lab (Batavia, IL). I worked there a year (LHC CMS detector), and it was so terrible I jumped right back to the private sector with ~5 other co-workers.

Oh I know Fermi hahaha, my hometown is literally next to Batavia (Geneva). I just wasn't listing all of the labs.

It was a bit surprising to me, but each lab really seems to have a completely different overall culture set, and then it splinters even further within each group. I worked at Livermore one summer, and the differences between them and Oak Ridge (my current employer) are stark. Part of it is that these labs do a lot of local hiring, so they get shaped by regional values.

Conversely, my significant other is an experimental nuclear physics PhD candidate who works at Brookhaven. Their stuff is open and international, while the labs I've worked at have very strict guards on information sharing and international collaboration.

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#33

Post by vonmoltke »

bchociej wrote: post #23
bane wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, the "right" way for companies to do it is to simple lease an office near a concentration of a few workers. Even if it's just 4 or 5 employees, a nice office with internet and a kitchen isn't very expensive. That way it's not "remote" work, it's just another corporate office location. Checking online in Kansas City, MO. 13,000 SF of office space runs < $10k/mo. That's a bargain. Spot checking other places (C…

That's exactly right. A friend of mine in St. Louis is currently negotiating $14/sq.ft. down to, ideally, $12. Last I heard from my CxO friend in California, he was excited to find $30. To me, it's shocking that anyone would start a business out there. (Okay, not really... there is a lot of money out there and it flows much more freely. But I couldn't personally justify spending my cash on 2.5x more expensive real es…

In the right suburbs of Dallas, you can get flex space for $6/sqft - $9/sqft. The area has great support infrastructure and talent pool for doing hardware, too.

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#35

Post by Dewie »

jakestl wrote: post #2

As a Midwesterner, I am slightly put off by the use of the term "outsourcing" in the title. Considering the term wasn't used in the article I feel it carries negative connotation. Maybe I am reading too deeply into this...

So what do you think about foreign developers who work for American companies (that are outsourced muscle)? That they are inferior? I feel like I'm being hostile now, but that is what seems to must follow, if you even accept the term outsourcing.

I think outsourcing is either motivated by 1. cost, which does not necessarily have anything to do with quality, might just be that the cost of living is very different, and the cost of living difference in this case seems to be non-negligible. 2. Expertise; we, as a company, don't want to/can't have an X department, so you guys can take care of it.

A possible barrier to productive outsourcing is a mismatch in cultures. In that case, you can't really blame the outsourced party for not being American/German/Austrian... This is a thing that can mask itself as incompetence.

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#36

Post by ahlatimer »

bane wrote: post #7

This is potentially a great way to go and solve the "engineering shortage" in the U.S. There are tons of qualified engineers in places all over the U.S., but S.V. never bothers to look for them. The great side benefit is that the cost of living in most of the U.S. is much lower than on the coasts meaning you can almost get 2 people in nowhere Alabama or Nashville, Someplace for the price of 1 San Franciscan or 1 New…

Judging by the recruiter spam I get, it's not entirely true that SV companies are not looking outside SV for employees -- it's just that they expect them to move to SF to work for their company. About 90% of the recruiter spam I get is from companies based in SF, but most of them are not open to remote workers.

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#37

Post by nanidin »

bane wrote: post #7

This is potentially a great way to go and solve the "engineering shortage" in the U.S. There are tons of qualified engineers in places all over the U.S., but S.V. never bothers to look for them. The great side benefit is that the cost of living in most of the U.S. is much lower than on the coasts meaning you can almost get 2 people in nowhere Alabama or Nashville, Someplace for the price of 1 San Franciscan or 1 New…

I don't see how two people producing the same output deserve different salaries based on where they live - why should geographic location dictate my salary relative to my peers?

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#38

Post by Pyrodogg »

The Valley != Access to Tech Jobs

Most of the Midwest doesn't have a dying need for "The Valley". This article reads a bit like SV is the saving grace of the Midwest, If only those people had access to tech.

I think there's a very healthy tech scene in many areas of the Midwest. I live in Minneapolis and there are plenty of local companies doing well with local people. There are also quite a few local resources for entrepreneurs without the need to be involved in SV.

For starters: http://tech.mn/

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#39

Post by htormey »

wyclif wrote: post #12
enjo wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to admit, as a fly-over stater (Colorado) I found the tone be pretty condescending. There's an air of "we're moving the stuff people in the valley are to smart to do" to it. I'm not sure if it's intended, but it seems like they think the midwest is only good for the entry level. That really amazing developers don't exist outside of the valley. If that's true, I for one hope they don't change their position. We…

Is it possible to get an entry-level engineering job in the Valley today? It doesn't seem like that's common at all. So if you're just starting out and particularly if you don't happen to have a boutique degree, where are you going to start at entry level as a developer? To me, it sounds like a great way to hire.

Yes, their are plenty of startups with less brand name recognition hiring. A friend of mine from a non technical background managed to get a decent PM job after finishing hackbrite.

Alternatively you can get in the door of a brand name company by doing QA for a year or so.I have multiple friends that transitioned from a liberals arts degree to being developers by first starting in QA. It's totally possible.

Internships are also a good way to get your foot in the door.

Re: Bringing Silicon Valley to the Midwest

#40

Post by hagbardgroup »

bchociej wrote: post #23
bane wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, the "right" way for companies to do it is to simple lease an office near a concentration of a few workers. Even if it's just 4 or 5 employees, a nice office with internet and a kitchen isn't very expensive. That way it's not "remote" work, it's just another corporate office location. Checking online in Kansas City, MO. 13,000 SF of office space runs < $10k/mo. That's a bargain. Spot checking other places (C…

That's exactly right. A friend of mine in St. Louis is currently negotiating $14/sq.ft. down to, ideally, $12. Last I heard from my CxO friend in California, he was excited to find $30. To me, it's shocking that anyone would start a business out there. (Okay, not really... there is a lot of money out there and it flows much more freely. But I couldn't personally justify spending my cash on 2.5x more expensive real es…

Quality of life is becoming much higher in both KC and STL over the last few years. Residential rents and house prices are cheap. Offices are practically free. The restaurants are becoming better and attuned to coastal sensibilities.

One point that should be mentioned it that both STL and KCMO have significant violent crime problems. The STL crime rate has been improving impressively. When I went there recently, I was shocked by relative improvement. Neighborhoods that were dilapidated in the mid-00s are now happening spots.

Flee the coasts! Opportunities await in the country!

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