Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left • Hacker News Board

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#31

Post by fredgrott » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:00 PM UTC

snarkyturtle wrote: post #27

jnazario wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as a cyclist in the US there's a very common scenario here, too - turning right, looking left, not looking into the turn and bam, cyclist at high risk. TO CLARIFY - the situation i am most referring to is a cross street, where the car is perpendicular to your path and would be coming from your left as a cyclist.

Isn't that pretty much why you always cycle with the direction of traffic? As a runner, I've been told to run against the flow for safety but almost always run into these types of situations (which is why I mostly go out of my way to run behind the cars stopped at intersections.)

no, other way around cycle against traffic to avoid right turn hit as you will be on the left side and see the trucks left turn ahead of time

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#32

Post by eli » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:01 PM UTC

rudedogg wrote: post #13

kristiandupont wrote: post #12

In Denmark, the term højresvingsulykke (right turn accident) is common, meaning when a car, typically a truck, turns right and hits a bicycle. Lots of people are killed from this every year. One theory is that it is primarily foreign truck drivers who are not accustomed to the high number of cyclists in Copenhagen. When I initially saw the title, I was expecting it to be a mistake and actually say "Why UPS Trucks Don…

It's reversed in the US. Lots of accidents occur when people make a left hand turn and don't see a motorcycle/bicycle going straight in the oncoming lane.

Indeed. A big problem in DC is cars making U-Turns (i.e. a hard left turn) and cutting across the bike lanes that run along the center of Pennsylvania Ave.

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#33

Post by georgemcbay » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:02 PM UTC

grannyg00se wrote: post #8

It's hard to imagine that a high number of intersections are so bad for left turns that a three right turn detour is warranted. I've seen some left turn lanes get severely backed up during rush hour on the busiest of streets, but as a general rule I'd expect the left turn would win. I'd be curious to see more data on this.

Depends on a lot of factors and as mentioned by ceejayoz, the routing is likely a lot more complicated than that, taking into account different trucks operating in the same areas, but I know of quite a few intersections (stop-light controlled rather than stop sign controlled) in my neighborhood where I prefer multiple rights to a left because right on red is allowed (if no oncoming traffic) and you can often make the 3 right turns much faster than waiting for the one left turn at a light.

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#34

Post by jeroen » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:03 PM UTC

trhaynes wrote: post #30

kristiandupont wrote: post #12

In Denmark, the term højresvingsulykke (right turn accident) is common, meaning when a car, typically a truck, turns right and hits a bicycle. Lots of people are killed from this every year. One theory is that it is primarily foreign truck drivers who are not accustomed to the high number of cyclists in Copenhagen. When I initially saw the title, I was expecting it to be a mistake and actually say "Why UPS Trucks Don…

I'm confused. Is this cyclist on the sidewalk?

Probably on the bike path, like this situation:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/86/Vrijligge...

Cars in the middle, bikes on the red lines. When cars go right, bikers are sometimes overlooked (mostly by not looking at all).

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#35

Post by jeorgun » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:04 PM UTC

snarkyturtle wrote: post #27

jnazario wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as a cyclist in the US there's a very common scenario here, too - turning right, looking left, not looking into the turn and bam, cyclist at high risk. TO CLARIFY - the situation i am most referring to is a cross street, where the car is perpendicular to your path and would be coming from your left as a cyclist.

Isn't that pretty much why you always cycle with the direction of traffic? As a runner, I've been told to run against the flow for safety but almost always run into these types of situations (which is why I mostly go out of my way to run behind the cars stopped at intersections.)

I think the situation being described is more like:

    ___      ↱↑____
       |   | TB|
       |       |
       |   |   |

(where T is the truck, and B the bike, natch).

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#36

Post by ntoshev » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:06 PM UTC

You really need a data driven approach in this. Gather statistics of actual vehicles going from point A to point B so that you know the best way to do it in the future.

I'm running a routing optimization service (http://fleetnavi.com if you are curious, but it's only in Bulgarian for now, although Chrome translate works really well on the site). The routes a mapping service like google maps will give you are not that great really, in many cases the data needed to do a perfect route are just not available. We aren't using the stats from routes in the past yet, but it's a next step that would clearly be beneficial.

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#37

Post by mistermann » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:11 PM UTC

Id very much like to know why they don't send a text+email prior to a physical delivery so I can confirm whether I will be home to take delivery and potentially offer a reroute address or simply say do not attempt, rather than the current approach of making three unsuccessful attempts.

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#38

Post by protomyth » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:12 PM UTC

Avshalom wrote: post #26

protomyth wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm just annoyed we have another article with an inaccurate title that doesn't actually have any examples in the article (like a map of different routes) that show the how and why. Its basically a UPS fluff piece with no substance. It really bugs me because this something to show folks the value of math and analysis. What types of problem solving go on that can really be improved by application of maps and big data.…

Not to defend the article too much but the title is accurate. It's imprecise but accurate. "UPS routing algorithms have an extremely strong weighting against left turns outside of residential non-through streets" is well within the errors bars of "UPS trucks don't turn left" when using a tool like conversational English. In fact the less data the article gives the more it should prefer "UPS trucks don't turn left" yo…

The article has the phrase I quoted that says the title is inaccurate. This is HN, shouldn't we at least have some meat and an article that doesn't directly say the title is wrong?

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#39

Post by analog31 » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:16 PM UTC

relet wrote: post #21

kristiandupont wrote: post #12

In Denmark, the term højresvingsulykke (right turn accident) is common, meaning when a car, typically a truck, turns right and hits a bicycle. Lots of people are killed from this every year. One theory is that it is primarily foreign truck drivers who are not accustomed to the high number of cyclists in Copenhagen. When I initially saw the title, I was expecting it to be a mistake and actually say "Why UPS Trucks Don…

This is a type of accident that is particular to countries that have bicycle lanes. Cities like for example Berlin have closed a large number of cycle lanes (where they are routed to the right of regular traffic) because of that reason, and replaced them with shared lanes.

In my locale, at least along my commute, the bike and car lanes merge at each major intersection. Maybe avoiding these accidents is the reason.

Re: Why UPS Trucks Rarely Turn Left

#40

Post by claudius » Sat, Apr 05, 2014, 10:18 PM UTC

acchow wrote: post #28

jnazario wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as a cyclist in the US there's a very common scenario here, too - turning right, looking left, not looking into the turn and bam, cyclist at high risk. TO CLARIFY - the situation i am most referring to is a cross street, where the car is perpendicular to your path and would be coming from your left as a cyclist.

It's generally a bad idea to "pass on the right", not just for cyclists (tho they are disproportionately harmed).

Non-optional bicycle lanes make this unavoidable and motorists still lobby for cyclists to be kept of ‘their’ road.