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Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

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Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#381

Post by 72deluxe »

eropple wrote: post #190
danford wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hate to burst your bubble, but the only thing apple has going for them is the iPhone, which is arguably a fad. The reason Rolex never goes out of style is because they never change their style, and apple is no Rolex like a lot of people seem to think. People easily forget about all the hype around the iMac g3. Sure, it changed the company, but they still have yet to over take windows. Now Android is out selling the i…

Only thing Apple has going for them is the iPhone. And the iPad, which is kicking the hell out of Android tablets (to my consternation, because I'm primarily an Android user and their tablets are terrible). And the Macbook Pro, which is making pretty major inroads at leading-edge companies. A buddy of mine is working on *nix software at IBM and they asked if he wanted a Thinkpad or an MBP; that blew my mind. They don…

Thinkpad or Macbook? Which did he choose?

Thinkpads are now Lenovo, not IBM. And MacBooks do run official Unix, so it'd make sense. Plus, he can look cool in a coffee shop :-)

(I love my MacBook, but don't use it coffee shops, as an aside.) Your point about iPads is very true. My wife has an iPad and it is joy to use. I have a Motorola Xoom that I really do love using and find very very useful but the standards aren't the same. I know the Xoom is old (some would say ancient) and is easy to develop for but the iPad truly does rule the Tablet waves.

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#382

Post by 72deluxe »

danford wrote: post #199
eropple wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only thing Apple has going for them is the iPhone. And the iPad, which is kicking the hell out of Android tablets (to my consternation, because I'm primarily an Android user and their tablets are terrible). And the Macbook Pro, which is making pretty major inroads at leading-edge companies. A buddy of mine is working on *nix software at IBM and they asked if he wanted a Thinkpad or an MBP; that blew my mind. They don…

You're right, how could I forget the iPad, the thing is the business model they have for all of their products is unsustainable. The iPad is doing well now, just as the iPhone did initially, but less and less people are buying the iPhone because the Android environment has had time to develop. Even chromebooks out sold mac books [1] in 2013. A lot of companies allow developers to use Linux too. The fact that people w…

I know Chromebooks outsold MacBooks but I don't think you can compare them. Chromebooks are like disposable cameras. If they are referring to the cheapy plastic things, I wonder if people are buying them as devices to use whilst on the toilet or in areas where mugging is a risk?

Most Chromebooks are glorified phone hardware. Even the one with the whizzbang screen has lousy soldered-on local storage, so it fails as a microcomputer. It essentially is a terminal with a fantastic screen. I certainly wouldn't attempt to use one to develop on (and I mean develop on, not RDP/VNC/SSH to a box elsewhere). Could I write C++ on it for multiple OSes thanks to virtualization on a Chromebook? I know my needs are niche but I don't think Chromebooks compete with MacBooks, even if they look similar-ish and one has outsold the other. Out of interest, have Kindles outsold MacBooks? Would that be the death-knell for MacBooks? Really is comparing Apples and Oranges I think.

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#383

Post by 72deluxe »

eropple wrote: post #219
Nullabillity wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A buddy of mine is working on *nix software at IBM and they asked if he wanted a Thinkpad or an MBP; that blew my mind. Except, you know, IBM doesn't have anything to do with Thinkpad anymore, and hasn't for years.

"Except, you know," that it's a highly conservative company and offering a line developer a Mac is, in my experience, kind of weird .

True, but I wonder if it is because they are both seen as "high end" laptops? I know that you can go to PC World and buy a £500 device or cheaper models but MacBooks and high-end Thinkpads have always commanded a higher location in the market. If I were to sell my MacBook and get another laptop, I think the only other option would be Thinkpads.

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#384

Post by 72deluxe »

bananas wrote: post #205
danford wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lambo is dominating the car market by your logic [1] [1] http://www.lambocars.com/lambonews/lamborghini_among_most_pr...

I'll get downvoted for this one but they have a similar characteristic as well: they both catch fire! I had a 2010 MBP go up in flames and an immediate colleague's one screen went phut and melted. Lambos do this too (google images)

What was the 2010 MBP made from? Do the unibody ones fare better than the plastic models? Were you typing so fast that the keyboard caught fire? Are you Superman?

Answers in order please.

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#385

Post by 72deluxe »

Pxtl wrote: post #291
bananas wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similar problem with IE for me. I raised a case with gold partner support when IE9 came out as it broke ClickOnce download prompting. Been bouncing back and forth between framework and IE teams ever since. Result: we now have to ship a .reg file to our clients before we can launch our shit via ClickOnce. That's only 2000 people we now have to hand hold through this.....

Yeah, ClickOnce should go down as one of the bigger dead-end embarrassments, since they torpedo'd installer projects in VS2012.

Why did they get rid of Installer Projects? We are still on VS2010 and although it isn't a massive issue to use a different installer system, it seems a very odd decision. I mean, you are writing apps for their OS using their tools. Why wouldn't you want to create an installer? Daft!

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#386

Post by 72deluxe »

SigmundA wrote: post #137
UK-AL wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No WPF is still there. XAML is still the basis for windows store apps, and windows phone apps.

XAML != WPF. XAML is a language for object instantiation, thats it. Similar to XIBs in the Apple world. There are no less than 3 similar but different and incompatible UI libraries that can be instantiated by XAML: WPF, Silverlight (WPF/e), and Windows store/phone (WinRT). WPF is dead like WinForms but the only solution for normal windows apps unless somethings changed with WinRT to make non full screen apps with. If…

Why would they do this? The cycle of new frameworks only to be killed again afterwards is frustrating.

Is everything just wrapped around Win32 like MFC was etc.?

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#387

Post by wsc981 »

RyanZAG wrote: post #173
MagerValp wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's particularly fair to lump Apple with the rest since 14 years later [1] the core OS is still open source [2], and they're actively working on several high profile open source projects (e.g. Webkit, CUPS, and clang). They're not exactly irrelevant either. [1] http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2000/04/05Apple-Releases-Dar... [2] http://opensource.apple.com/

Given that all of those are already open sourced, do you know how bad it would look to close source them now? Especially Webkit/KHTML - that would be a PR disaster. I don't keep track of what Apple does - have they open sourced anything within the last few years? If not, I think they fit right in with the other companies.

Apple also open-sourced their boot process software (launchd[0], which was fully developed in-house IIRC.

[0]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Launchd

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#388

Post by bad_user »

72deluxe wrote: post #374
bad_user wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10 years ago Microsoft was unlike any other big company because of their stronghold on personal computing - being able to use their monopoly on one market to crush their competition in other markets and they did so repeatedly. Startup founders for example always had to take into account the "Microsoft problem". I don't blame them for bundling IE in Windows, not bundling a browser would be foolish and you can say that…

You're right about the Mac OS IE version not being the same. It was far better than the Windows one!

It may have been, but it was dropped on the floor, which happened after Mac OS was using it as the default browser as part of their 1997 deal with Microsoft, to be replaced with Safari in 2003 - pretty late IMHO.

This year's technical excellence can be next year's pain in the ass, as seen with IExplorer. And I don't understand why they haven't open-sourced IExplorer yet.

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#389

Post by sharpneli »

danabramov wrote: post #101
migueldeicaza wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

F# is already distributed with Mono as it is open source Lots of people use it

I'm not sure any of this would have happened without Miguel. Mono really gave .NET a second life when MS dropped the ball. It's also somehow satisfying to witness Xamarin's success and further opening of .NET after all the bashing and hating Mono received from the free software community.

To be honest Mono was a rather uncertain platform due to patent issues and the Oracle vs Google lawsuit.

Now that MS has released the stuff under Apache license things have really changed.

Re: Microsoft Open Sources C# Compiler

#390

Post by mmorris »

72deluxe wrote: post #372
nightski wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I payed $99 for VS2013 Professional, as did many others. Which is probably a key factor in why it is the fastest selling release.

How did you get it so cheap? Is it an educational one that has restrictions on releasing applications produced with it?

Looks like there was an MSDN deal for upgrades from VS 2012 (expired on Jan 31, 2014 though).

http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/The-99-VS2012-Pr...

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