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Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

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Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#791

Post by wpietri »

wwweston wrote: post #574
phillmv wrote: post #14

From the recode recap - http://recode.net/2014/04/03/mozilla-co-founder-brendan-eich... >“It’s clear that Brendan cannot lead Mozilla in this setting,” said Baker, who added that she would not and could not speak for Eich. “The ability to lead — particularly for the CEO — is fundamental to the role and that is not possible here.” The most damning aspect of this was their a) inability to predict this would be an issue…

> "I understand how my activities can be seen as divisive and wrong and inconsistent with my commitment to upholding the diverse values underpinning the Mozilla community and I apologize for my behaviour at the time. I will do everything in my power to make up for it and I hope the community can judge me based me on my record from this point onwards". This is close enough to what he actually said: https://brendaneich…

The difference to me is that he hasn't admitted his previous views or apologized for the harm he did. Saying, in effect, "Oh, I don't want to talk about helping to strip gay people of their civil rights, but I promise at work I'll be totally awesome," struck me as a) weaselly, and b) unconvincing.

Personally, I don't care much about the donation alone. But his handling of it has been terrible. If he had owned his action and apologized, this would have been a small issue. But from both a staff- and media-relations perspective, leaving this an open issue and trying to dodge the meat of it was a mistake. It's that that makes me think he might not have been a good CEO.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#792

Post by gcb0 »

wpietri wrote: post #740
gfodor wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I support legalizing gay marriage. But two things, first, supporting prop 8 does not mean you "believe a certain group of people don't deserve to live their lives like others." It means you don't believe that the government should recognize same sex marriages as marriages. There are a large gradient of views here, and on one extreme are the bigots who hate homosexuals and on the other there are people who simply have…

Putting money behind Prop 8 helped strip a civil right from gay people. It's technically true that proves nothing about Eich's beliefs. Heck, maybe it was Eich's personal Opposite Day. But does it matter? Even the bible says, "You will know them by their fruits," meaning that it's reasonable to judge people by what they do. The pseudo-gotcha about tolerance is ridiculous, an accusation of hypocrisy based on a straw m…

heh. can't not appreciate the irony of defending public shaming someone because of a hint that he may be anti-gay rights ...with a bible quote.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#793

Post by [deleted] »

camus2 wrote: post #323
cousin_it wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, freedom of speech means exactly that people shouldn't be punished for speech. What else could it possibly mean?

Freedom of speech only means the government cant supress your speech. There is no freedom of speech when it comes to the corporate envirronment, and even less when you are a public figure of a business. So this is not a freedom of speech issue. Eich is free to say whatever he wants, and Mozilla is free to decide wether what Eich says is compatible with its CEO position or not.

[deleted]

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#794

Post by gcb0 »

dopamean wrote: post #131
DangerousPie wrote: post #45

I am a strong supporter of gay marriage, but I have to say that I find this very unfortunate and worrying. Apparently many Mozilla supporters seem to think it is okay to bully a qualified person out of his job only for his political views, even if they had absolutely no effect on his qualification or his actions on the job. I can't help but feel like this campaign has done a lot more harm to him than his $1000 donati…

I generally agree with you but I think the problem here is that being against gay marriage is more than just a "political view." Being for low taxes is a political view. Being for smaller government is a political view. Believing a certain group of people don't deserve to live their lives like other simply because of who they love is not a political view. It reads as extremely hateful and that makes people uncomforta…

If you like to extrapolate...

Paying more taxes and a larger government is more apt to distribute wellfare properly.

Most child deaths are in poor families.

So voting for less taxes and a smaller gov is directly killing babies.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#795

Post by hackinthebochs »

Aloisius wrote: post #295
cousin_it wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, freedom of speech means exactly that people shouldn't be punished for speech. What else could it possibly mean?

No, it means freedom from state censorship and state punishment (imprisonment for instance). The public can punish you all they want.

I absolutely cringe every time someone pulls out the "freedom from government suppression" card. Its amazing how quick people are to put the principle of freedom of speech into a box when it suits their agenda. Absolutely shameful. Freedom of speech is an idea that permeates the very core of our society. That people now want to constrain it to simply government suppression is a sad commentary of our culture.

Just about every aspect of our lives are ruled by corporations, and definitely every avenue of communication. I absolutely refuse to accept that corporations can control what is acceptable for me to say. This is exactly the road you guys are going down when you make statements like this.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#796

Post by muyuu »

wnoise wrote: post #780
muyuu wrote: post #390

Wow. The bullying of Brendan Eich really makes me question whether I should support Mozilla any longer. And ashamed I have donated in the past. This is pure fascism.

Fascism is a form of radical authoritarian nationalism, combined with a regulated economic structure of cooperation between major corporations and the government. This is rather different.

You are right, this is McCarthyism. I didn't find the right word at the time.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#797

Post by bashcoder »

matthewmacleod wrote: post #426
MrZongle2 wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First: thank you for responding, regardless of your up/down/no vote. But I disagree that his personal opinions were incompatible with Mozilla. They make software, Eich makes software. Mozilla has nothing to do with social activism. Well, at least, they didn't until now .

Mozilla explicitly states that one of it's goals is to foster an inclusive and diverse software community. In their position, where they do so much work related to community engagement, do you not see how the views of their CEO conflicting with their stated mission is a problem?

Whatever your beliefs, I'm not sure how this saga fosters either inclusiveness or diversity, and I'm afraid the word community has lost all meaning.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#799

Post by lholden »

DangerousPie wrote: post #45

I am a strong supporter of gay marriage, but I have to say that I find this very unfortunate and worrying. Apparently many Mozilla supporters seem to think it is okay to bully a qualified person out of his job only for his political views, even if they had absolutely no effect on his qualification or his actions on the job. I can't help but feel like this campaign has done a lot more harm to him than his $1000 donati…

I have a hard time when segregation gets labeled as a "political view".

Segregation is a lot more than a political issue, but also a human rights issue. That $1000 actively helped pass a bill that prevented consenting adult couples who wished to spend their lives together from having the same legal rights as everyone else. His donation in this case was more than having a political view, but actually helped to promote segregation.

Why would I want someone who has tried to take away my rights as the CEO of a company that I care about? If it was just his "view", this would not be the issue that it has been.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#800

Post by err4nt »

byuu wrote: post #591
devindotcom wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to minimize the issue, but receiving death threats is rapidly becoming part of being a public figure on the Internet. Columnists, reporters, celebrities, and many others receive them all the time. It's definitely unacceptable, but it's not like we have shown an ability to control it, and I can't think of any assassinations of high-profile Internet figures. I'm surprised you're surprised at people, though! Death t…

> Not to minimize the issue, but receiving death threats is rapidly becoming part of being a public figure on the Internet. Indeed, I've gotten quite a few death threats myself over the years for my radical cause of trying to improve the quality of video game emulators. The problem with the internet is that you can't really judge a person's mental state from a text post. Quite often the person on the other end making…

I was a LONGTIME Digger before that though had even occurred to me. The crazy folks who shout at you on the bus aren't exactly going to be eloquent when they sit down to type are they ;)
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