Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO • Hacker News Board

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#191

Post by camus2 » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:35 PM UTC

Touche wrote: post #128

This really saddens me. It is a black-mark on the gay rights movement. Eich made a mistake when he supported prop 8. History will clearly show this, like history has shown those who opposed interracial marriage were wrong. Being on the right-side of history isn't about stomping out those who opposed you when you finally win. It's not about retribution for past slights. Did we learn nothing from Nelson Mandela?

> Eich made a mistake when he supported prop 8

Nothing proves that Eich think he did make a mistake. He never apologized for that and refused to talk about it.I'm sure he would not need to resign if he did apologize. People make mistakes, and most people will forgive if an apology is issued.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#192

Post by danudey » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:35 PM UTC

return0 wrote: post #54

Oculus wrote: post #6

I'm not sure how I feel about this one. On the one hand, Brendan Eich had some beliefs that were against Mozilla's core values, but on the other hand we just showed that when a mob on the Internet wants something - they get it. It's scary because this mob has global reach, unlimited power, but isn't always right.

For example, if the mob tomorrow decides that it's OK to give up privacy for "security", mozilla will happily have to oblige to become a state security tool. That's why strong leadership with values is needed.

I don't think 'standing in the way of equality' is really the kind of values that Mozilla needs.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#193

Post by Zelphyr » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:35 PM UTC

sethbannon wrote: post #57

Comments here are pretty supportive of Brendan but I see this as nothing but a victory for Mozilla and a victory for consumer activism. It should be clear by now that you cannot run a large company in the public eye while you espouse vitriolic and discriminatory views that belong in the last century.

There is ample evidence that he never once espoused his views at Mozilla. So much so that his own co-founder didn't realize he had such a position until it came to light 13 years into their working relationship.

What the LGBT community needs is true victory where they're treated no differently from anyone else. This is only a victory for the righteous indignation that is rampant on the Internet.

It is pretty sad that those who were most vocal about Mr. Eich stepping down because of his beliefs no doubt have little problem giving their money to the likes of Orson Scott Card who I would submit is considerably more harmful to the cause than Brendan Eich has been.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#194

Post by lxt » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:35 PM UTC

Borogove wrote: post #92

matthewmacleod wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

on the other hand we just showed that when a mob on the Internet wants something - they get it. I don't think that this follows. In this particular case, someone was promoted to a role which many felt was incompatible with his personal views; they made that known, and the person in question stepped down. That's kind of how things should work in a community enterprise. That said, I understand he's received wildly disp…

Were there actually threats? I just googled "Brendan Eich threat" and didn't see anything relevant.

I work at Mozilla. I don't know about Brendan, but other employees definitely received multiple death threats.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#195

Post by platz » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:36 PM UTC

urschrei wrote: post #157

platz wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, just folks like Erin Kissane: http://incisive.nu/2014/thinking-about-mozilla/

Erin's article is the least mob-like thing I can think of: "I don’t see there’s much to gain by asking Brendan to resign." And then: "Beyond that I guess I only have one more thing to say, which is to Brendan, who is doubtless also having one of the most challenging weeks of his professional life. Brendan, I grew up in a very conservative religious home and many of the people I love the most can still be described as…

"Mob" wasn't to be taken literally. Partly, responding with scarcasm but I guess it didn't come across that way. She has some good commentary on the issue - it's not black and white.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#196

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:36 PM UTC

sethbannon wrote: post #57

Comments here are pretty supportive of Brendan but I see this as nothing but a victory for Mozilla and a victory for consumer activism. It should be clear by now that you cannot run a large company in the public eye while you espouse vitriolic and discriminatory views that belong in the last century.

[deleted]

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#197

Post by Borogove » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:36 PM UTC

lxt wrote: post #194

Borogove wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were there actually threats? I just googled "Brendan Eich threat" and didn't see anything relevant.

I work at Mozilla. I don't know about Brendan, but other employees definitely received multiple death threats.

Why would anyone else get threatened?

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#198

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:36 PM UTC

dopamean wrote: post #109

chrismonsanto wrote: post #11

My #1 question -- is Eich returning to CTO, another position, or quitting altogether? All in all, I think this was a pragmatic move. I am not a fan of this "CEO = literally the company" logic, though. I saw no reason to believe that he would use Mozilla to further an anti-gay agenda.

> I saw no reason to believe that he would use Mozilla to further an anti-gay agenda. I agree. However, it's a little weird if you say you are a company who values diversity and different lifestyles but you have a CEO who is openly against a particular group of people. That kind of contradiction at the very top makes things weird.

[deleted]

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#199

Post by nostrademons » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:36 PM UTC

danpalmer wrote: post #111

nostrademons wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It speaks a lot to his integrity that he didn't. Would you rather have a CEO who says one thing in public and then goes and does another thing surreptitiously, or one who stands up for his beliefs even when they're unpopular?

I don't think 'integrity' in the face of an opinion that is becoming more and more unacceptable to hold in our culture is a good thing. Changing your views, and admitting you were wrong is the best thing you can do.

This line of reasoning is very troubling to me, because 20 years ago it was pretty much unacceptable in the U.S. to hold the opinion that gays were entitled to full legal rights, let alone the ability to marry. That changed only because some very courageous people stuck their neck out, weathered all the flack and negative personal repercussions towards themselves, and gradually made the point of "Why not?"

I fully support gay marriage and I personally think Brendan is on the wrong side of this issue, but I also fully support the right of people to hold their own opinions, even when other people find them unpopular. If they weren't allowed to hold unpopular opinions, then pretty much all the social progress we made in the last century - racial equality, feminism, gay rights, etc. - would never have happened.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#200

Post by gyardley » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:36 PM UTC

While this is a good first step, we're also going to need to boycott JavaScript and the companies that use it until JavaScript is replaced with a non-discriminatory alternative.