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OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

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Re: OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

#71

Post by dotBen »

Todd wrote: post #26

Why doesn't OkCupid take a bolder stance and remove all JavaScript from their site? Brendan invented it. I guess that wouldn't be convenient. Better to ask users to inconvenience themselves. This really isn't fair to all of the people who have worked so hard to make Firefox what it is today.

Probably because while he may have invented Javascript, many people have contributed to it, so that's not really the same issue. We should assume there might be racists/biggots/etc working at Google on Chrome, at Apple on Safari and at Microsoft on Internet Explorer, too. That's not the point.

The issue is with Mozilla placing him as their executive leader; the endorsement that makes and the message that sends to the technical community & the wider world.

Re: OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

#74

Post by dictum »

davidgerard wrote: post #59
Todd wrote: post #26

Why doesn't OkCupid take a bolder stance and remove all JavaScript from their site? Brendan invented it. I guess that wouldn't be convenient. Better to ask users to inconvenience themselves. This really isn't fair to all of the people who have worked so hard to make Firefox what it is today.

Because there is no trivially replaceable substitute for JavaScript in the site construction, as there is for the browser.

Last time I used OkCupid, I can't remember anything that would actually require JS to work. Real time updates (for instance, in IM) wouldn't be possible, but exchanging messages, looking at profiles and answering quiz questions is perfectly doable without JS.

(I know I always sound like someone who hates JavaScript, but at least for the stuff OkC had two years ago, it's not really crucial. IIRC, you could browse user profiles with JS off, but IM didn't work with JS off.)

Re: OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

#76

Post by peterevans »

Todd wrote: post #26

Why doesn't OkCupid take a bolder stance and remove all JavaScript from their site? Brendan invented it. I guess that wouldn't be convenient. Better to ask users to inconvenience themselves. This really isn't fair to all of the people who have worked so hard to make Firefox what it is today.

Javascript is not solely the product of Mozilla. It exists by itself, is standardized as ECMAScript, and provides no royalties to Brendan Eich. Firefox is a product of Mozilla. Mozilla, and by extension Eich, benefits from people using Firefox to browse the internet, particularly from searching Google through Mozilla's start page.

Whatever you think of Eich, of Mozilla, or of the entire situation, Firefox and Javascript are not the same thing here. If anyone means to make their displeasure felt in Mozilla's revenue, banning Javascript wouldn't make sense.

Re: OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

#77

Post by whyenot »

Zikes wrote: post #52
davidgerard wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no easy swap-in replacement.

It's good to know we can set aside our moral values when convenience is at stake.

The point is to make a statement and educate users. Not cut off your nose to spite your face.

Re: OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

#78

Post by gojomo »

And if this doesn't work, eventually when you try to message a Catholic, Mormon, Muslim, or other religiously-observant person from a denomination whose leaders publicly disapprove of homosexuality, you'll see a message from OKCupid like:

Religion isn't normally the business of a website. But you've expressed an interest in dating someone whose religion denies equal rights to gay people. Sure, this person may seem OK, and may even have their own opinions, but the leaders of their religion spread hatred, and it pains us to send even a single quantum of relationship happiness towards people who still affiliate with that religion.

If you still want to date them, you can click the link below, but wouldn't you really rather date the following matches, who we've determined from their public and private questionnaire answers better reflect OKCupid's approved religious and political values?

Seriously, I would have expected a dating website to have a deeper respect for the often-arbitrary reasons individual beliefs deviate from the norms of their family, employer, or community.

Re: OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

#79

Post by lingben »

dotBen wrote: post #71
Todd wrote: post #26

Why doesn't OkCupid take a bolder stance and remove all JavaScript from their site? Brendan invented it. I guess that wouldn't be convenient. Better to ask users to inconvenience themselves. This really isn't fair to all of the people who have worked so hard to make Firefox what it is today.

Probably because while he may have invented Javascript, many people have contributed to it, so that's not really the same issue. We should assume there might be racists/biggots/etc working at Google on Chrome, at Apple on Safari and at Microsoft on Internet Explorer, too. That's not the point. The issue is with Mozilla placing him as their executive leader; the endorsement that makes and the message that sends to the…

You can argue the exact same thing for mozilla and firefox: Brendan did not create firefox/mozilla, he's one of thousands who contributed.

People can have their own personal beliefs and as long as that doesn't effect the organization's open and inclusive policies.

Re: OkCupid urges users to abandon Firefox

#80

Post by duaneb »

gocarsno wrote: post #58
davidgerard wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_as_bad_as "The "not as bad as" argument, or the fallacy of relative privation, is a form of the moral equivalence fallacy that takes note of the existence of things that are worse than what is actually under discussion - for different purposes, as outlined below. It's popular with people who know perfectly well they're doing something wrong; being fully aware that they're doing someth…

I don't see how that's relevant.

Just because Uganda is "worse" than opposing gay marriage does not imply that opposing gay marriage is at all positive.
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