Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#311

Post by r00fus » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:18 PM UTC

jusben1369 wrote: post #117

nknighthb wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be pretty damn actively aggressive if someone was trying to make me apologize for manufacturing a car that kept its occupant safe in a 110mph crash.

I think that's how he feels. And yet they've decided to add the titanium plate. Which is why maybe someone else should (help) write these.

Why? I think it sounds better directly from him.

The industry is full of non-personal appeals. One that's personal and stays personal even if it's a bit defensive, is just more authentic and appealing.

Besides who reads these? I doubt a large percentage of potential buyers do - mostly likely already fans of Tesla, who probably agree with Musk anyway.

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#312

Post by dhughes » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:25 PM UTC

downandout wrote: post #121

zacharycohn wrote: post #5

"We believe these changes will also help prevent a fire resulting from an extremely high speed impact that tears the wheels off the car, like the other Model S impact fire, which occurred last year in Mexico. This happened after the vehicle impacted a roundabout at 110 mph, shearing off 15 feet of concrete curbwall and tearing off the left front wheel, then smashing through an eight foot tall buttressed concrete wall…

> This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Do you mean ridiculous as in you believe that he is exaggerating, or ridiculous as in it is amazing that the car held up so well? I doubt that he would simply make up verifiable facts concerning a specific, well publicized accident to make his company look better. That said, it is quite clear from these facts that this driver is lucky to be breathing today regardle…

I think it's amazing how any vehicle maker can idiot-proof any vehicle, the general population seems to be suicidal and then blames the manufacturer for not protecting them during their 110mph missile ride.

reddit's /r/Justrolledintotheshop and /r/TalesFromRetail/ makes me wonder how people manage to use any product without killing themselves.

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#313

Post by alexeisadeski3 » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:30 PM UTC

Crito wrote: post #298

alexeisadeski3 wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla was handled with kid gloves compared to Toyota. Remember the unintended acceleration crock?

The Toyota Acceleration issue ranks up there with the McDonald's Coffee lawsuit as one of the most doubly misunderstood corporate events in recent history. Popular belief has there being an acceleration problem with Toyota cars. Slightly less popular is the correction that in fact it was all just senile old people and floor mats, nothing to do with the computers. Far less common is the correction that there were in f…

According to NHTSA, there was not a technical problem:

In February 2011 the findings of a 10-month-long study conducted by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) and the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA), aimed to identify the main cause of sudden acceleration in Toyota and Lexus models. The study was requested by the US Congress and "enlisted NASA engineers with expertise in areas such as computer controlled electronic systems, electromagnetic interference and software integrity".[229] The most common problem was drivers hitting the gas when they thought they were hitting the brake, which the NHTSA called "pedal misapplication.”[229] Of the 58 cases reported, 18 were dismissed out of hand. Of the remaining 40, 39 of them were found to have no cause; the remainder being an instance of “pedal entrapment.”

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#314

Post by aunty_helen » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:30 PM UTC

rkalla wrote: post #300

This is what you get when a company/group/effort/community is lead by a "benevolent dictator" - someone with an absolutely pure vision of what they want their output to look like and the autonomy and strength to make it so no matter what. I love this... I actually love that it probably pissed off Musk to no end the amount of attention the fires got and out of spite he went totally over the top and added ballistic pla…

It will be interesting to see how this approach changes when the money is a bit tighter ie the model c. You can't just go and add titanium reinforcing to a 30k$ car whenever something bad happens.

I think something to moderate Musk's thin skin wouldn't be a bad thing but I certainly agree that the absolute power to do what ever he wants coupled to his technical depth has and will continue to see him changing the transport industry.

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#315

Post by alexeisadeski3 » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:31 PM UTC

jamesaguilar wrote: post #291

alexeisadeski3 wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla was handled with kid gloves compared to Toyota. Remember the unintended acceleration crock?

Um, it wasn't crock. They recently settled a huge lawsuit and criminal investigation with the US government to the tune of $1.2B. http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/03/19/toyota-s...

It was a crock: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%9311_Toyota_vehicle_...

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#316

Post by alexeisadeski3 » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:31 PM UTC

shuffle2 wrote: post #290

alexeisadeski3 wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla was handled with kid gloves compared to Toyota. Remember the unintended acceleration crock?

You mean this one? http://embeddedgurus.com/state-space/2014/02/are-we-shooting...

Yes, this one:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%9311_Toyota_vehicle_...

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#317

Post by Dylan16807 » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:35 PM UTC

baddox wrote: post #250

RyanMcGreal wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cost-benefit analysis, psychopath style.

In all honesty, how would you recommend doing cost benefit analysis for a car manufacturer? There will always be safety risks to the drivers, after all.

A similar equation is fine, but 'average settlement' is probably too low. Add 10 million to C before multiplying and you have a better balance, with a margin of error on the side of safety.

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#318

Post by hahainternet » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:44 PM UTC

mpg33 wrote: post #308

rkalla wrote: post #300

This is what you get when a company/group/effort/community is lead by a "benevolent dictator" - someone with an absolutely pure vision of what they want their output to look like and the autonomy and strength to make it so no matter what. I love this... I actually love that it probably pissed off Musk to no end the amount of attention the fires got and out of spite he went totally over the top and added ballistic pla…

> This is what you get when a company/group/effort/community is lead by a "benevolent dictator" - someone with an absolutely pure vision of what they want their output to look like and the autonomy and strength to make it so no matter what. Good explanation of Steve Jobs as well IMO

Unfortunately not. Apple's success was many times despite Jobs. He was indeed a visionary, but 'benevolent' is the precise wrong term for him.

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#319

Post by Crito » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:47 PM UTC

alexeisadeski3 wrote: post #313

Crito wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Toyota Acceleration issue ranks up there with the McDonald's Coffee lawsuit as one of the most doubly misunderstood corporate events in recent history. Popular belief has there being an acceleration problem with Toyota cars. Slightly less popular is the correction that in fact it was all just senile old people and floor mats, nothing to do with the computers. Far less common is the correction that there were in f…

According to NHTSA, there was not a technical problem: In February 2011 the findings of a 10-month-long study conducted by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) and the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA), aimed to identify the main cause of sudden acceleration in Toyota and Lexus models. The study was requested by the US Congress and "enlisted NASA engineers with expertise in ar…

Toyota cars did not fail safe in the event that both the accelerator and the brakes were pressed. Combined with the floor mats, this could create dangerous situations where drivers were unable to stop their cars using the brakes (the standard objections that they should have turned their cars off or shifted out of gear still have some validity of course) The two sibling comments to my above comment address other potential technical problems with Toyota vehicles. Your Wikipedia link does not refute their points.

Reiterated:

What the NHTSA believed that they found in 2011 is overshadowed by more recent developments, mainly that Toyota was not being forthcoming with the NHTSA. In 2014, Holder said "Today, we can say for certain that Toyota intentionally concealed information and misled the public about the safety issues behind these recalls," Additionally: "The cover-up is still there on the electronics issue," says Sean Kane, an auto safety expert for Safety Research and Strategies. "This (government penalty) sends an important message, but it's a mixed message." Furthermore it has become clear that Toyota's code was a clusterfuck and that the alleged failure modes were very possible.

My point is that in both the Mcdonalds case and the Toyota case, the issue is not nearly as clear cut as the two most popular points of view present.

Re: Tesla Adds Titanium Underbody Shield and Aluminum Deflector Plates to Model S

#320

Post by Dylan16807 » Fri, Mar 28, 2014, 9:50 PM UTC

lotsofmangos wrote: post #237

nailer wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say any existed. Re-read the comment.

Huh? Are you completely and utterly mental? You were stating what you normally do when you read something saying that it is by Elon Musk on Medium. To claim that you have a normal behaviour for a given situation would usually presuppose that it is a situation you have previously encountered, more than once.

The repeated situation is part of "Medium is famous for internet drama, and more recently parody articles about Medium and internet drama."

nailer filled in the template to illustrate the response to the template, not to assert that they had encountered this specific variant before.

The use of 'normally' implies having been in the exact situation, but it's possible to have a default response to a situation without having been in it. In context it is very easy to figure out nailer's meaning. It is ridiculous of you to fall back to 'completely and utterly mental'.