Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro • Hacker News Board

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#41

Post by stan_rogers » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:07 PM UTC

droelf wrote: post #19

greggman wrote: post #5

Maybe someday the gIMP will be even close to Photoshop. Heck, maybe it is for some people's needs. But, I'm not even an artist and the gIMP doesn't come close to meeting my needs. "No decent OpenType typography, no layer styles, no smart objects, no dice." (from the comments on the OP) If all I need to do is crop or scale an image than sure, I might get by with gIMP though in that case I'd arguably get by better with…

I agree on some points, but for the non destructive photo adjustment there is an excellent open source alternative caleld darktable which you should check out if you haven't: http://www.darktable.org/ Arguably, they don't support none of the vector layers, but thats something you could do in Inkscape. Agreed that it might be more convenient to stay in one tool, though.

Darktable is like Lightroom; it has the same editing limitations as Lightroom (or Adobe Camera Raw, for that matter). It's nothing at all like what non-destructive editing in Photoshop means.

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#42

Post by jebblue » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:11 PM UTC

dperfect wrote: post #32

pessimizer wrote: post #25

This is like using Vim-mode to switch to Emacs, or installing Lindows. If people could accept the trivial conventions of the software you're moving to ("How can I use GIMP? The hotkeys are different!") and stop treating it like a free badly-executed Photoshop clone, they might realize that it's really nice to work in. My problems with GIMP were the CMYK stuff and a few terminology issues. I really love the GIMP inter…

The thing you're missing is that the differences between GIMP and Photoshop are not just user interface idioms. I wish it were that simple (I'd love to switch to GIMP if I could). It's not a matter of "learning something new"; it's the fact that without real non-destructive editing features, GIMP is basically just an enhanced version of MS Paint in the hands of serious photographers and retouchers. Non-destructive ed…

>> and one that apparently the GIMP devs seem to be ignoring

If you can code then contribute the feature, if not then hire someone to write it and contribute it and if neither then at least file a bug/feature request.

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#43

Post by bayesianhorse » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:12 PM UTC

While I never used photoshop, I also never quite liked the gimp.

I actually sometimes use blender (yes, the 3D software) to edit photos. It's not the same paradigm as photoshop or the gimp, but it lets me do advanced color grading very easily. I can use textured 3D objects for 2D Animations or non-destructive editing. As an added bonus it works for videos and the compositing setup can be reused for multiple photos. Probably if I were really adventurous I could use more of the paint mode and texture paint mode to get even closer to photoshop. But then again I'm not a pro...

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#44

Post by logfromblammo » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:15 PM UTC

I think it is a mistake to measure GIMP against a standard set by Photoshop. If a person wants a program to work like Photoshop, they should probably use Photoshop. The standard for GIMP should be whether you can use it to accomplish your goal.

You might as well publish a guide on how to make a circular table saw cut like a band saw. That's completely useless both to anyone who doesn't already know how to use a band saw, and to anyone who already satisfies all their wood-cutting requirements with the circular saw. They are different tools; they don't need to work the same way.

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#45

Post by th0ma5 » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:15 PM UTC

As a developer, I've often felt that if I can't script something, embed it into my own software or service, or even redistribute it, then I haven't really done it with software. This is an unrealistic goal if I was in DTP work still, but by setting this bar, I've been amazed about how my understanding of the context of a problem has broadened my horizons. For instance I feel I now have a great grasp on Nurbs, Voxels, and 3d meshes in general from having done it all with Clojure instead of Blender. Batch processing with Imagemagick is now so second nature to me I can't stomach the idea of having to load up PS or even Gimp.

I think when the process involves subtle interactive hand touches and nuances, then an interactive editor will always win out. However rudimentary, discrete "operations" are things computers should do well, and PS and Gimp fall short in my opinion. Gimp being slightly better sort of with its open scripting.

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#46

Post by dperfect » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:17 PM UTC

jebblue wrote: post #42

dperfect wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing you're missing is that the differences between GIMP and Photoshop are not just user interface idioms. I wish it were that simple (I'd love to switch to GIMP if I could). It's not a matter of "learning something new"; it's the fact that without real non-destructive editing features, GIMP is basically just an enhanced version of MS Paint in the hands of serious photographers and retouchers. Non-destructive ed…

>> and one that apparently the GIMP devs seem to be ignoring If you can code then contribute the feature, if not then hire someone to write it and contribute it and if neither then at least file a bug/feature request.

Non-destructive editing has been on the list of GIMP feature requests and roadmaps for many years. I may be wrong, but it sounds like the problem is more a misalignment of project goals with target user requirements rather than a sheer lack of development resources at this point (since so many other features have been implemented in the meantime).

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#47

Post by rhizome » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:21 PM UTC

k__ wrote: post #37

dperfect wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing you're missing is that the differences between GIMP and Photoshop are not just user interface idioms. I wish it were that simple (I'd love to switch to GIMP if I could). It's not a matter of "learning something new"; it's the fact that without real non-destructive editing features, GIMP is basically just an enhanced version of MS Paint in the hands of serious photographers and retouchers. Non-destructive ed…

Shouldn't you know what you want to to, if you're a professional? If you don't know what you want to accomplish, you need to experiment. This is when those non-destructive features come in handy, but if you know the goal and how to achieve it, they aren't necessary.

"Shit's Easy Syndrome": http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2009/04/have-you-ever-legali...

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#48

Post by drzaiusapelord » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:23 PM UTC

pessimizer wrote: post #25

This is like using Vim-mode to switch to Emacs, or installing Lindows. If people could accept the trivial conventions of the software you're moving to ("How can I use GIMP? The hotkeys are different!") and stop treating it like a free badly-executed Photoshop clone, they might realize that it's really nice to work in. My problems with GIMP were the CMYK stuff and a few terminology issues. I really love the GIMP inter…

Especially odd considering there is a free photoshop clone called Paint.net for windows. Its like a really old version of photoshop.

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#49

Post by Delmania » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:28 PM UTC

jordigh wrote: post #3

This reminds me of the endless bug reports we're getting right now about the Octave GUI not being indistinguishable from Matlab. Makes me wish people weren't so inflexible about the tiniest UI differences. It's difficult to please the converts.

It's not that people are inflexible, it's that if you're going to provide an alternative, it should slip itself into someone's workflow and processes with almost no inertia. When someone is accustomed to hitting a keystroke to achieve a certain effect, or someone is using to having a widget in the left corner, any change to that process is going to cause discomfort, and most people don't need that.

Re: Switch from Photoshop to Gimp: Tips From a Pro

#50

Post by themodelplumber » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:31 PM UTC

dperfect wrote: post #14

If you're using Photoshop for the purpose it was designed for (editing photos, not illustration/painting from scratch), then GIMP is absolutely inferior in its current form. If you're making edits directly to source pixel layers (or even making duplicate flattened layers and working on those), you're doing it wrong. Photoshop is designed for non-destructive editing. An essential part of that is adjustment layers. Man…

If you're making edits directly to source pixel layers (or even making duplicate flattened layers and working on those), you're doing it wrong.

That seems like a rather absolutist statement. I work with PS CC and its great features all day at work but I guess I still remember the fantastic work that was done before those features existed.

I have colleagues who still edit their photos using the apparently-despised techniques you mentioned, and despite "doing it wrong" they manage to make a great living off their photography work.

When I was teaching PS at my local college, I allowed my students to try out alternative software packages for extra credit. Some of my brightest students walked away from those classes happy that they could do everything they needed to do with GIMP, even though they knew all about non-destructive editing.