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Turkish government takes down YouTube too

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Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#61

Post by toyg »

jann wrote: post #39
toyg wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, like US and UK populations voted out their chief warmongers pronto, once it came out that the rationale for getting into the Iraq war was fabricated... oh wait

I'm very sorry but I really don't like that argument. That doesn't make it any less ghastly for others to be like that as well. The argument you bring seems similar to what people say about the Crimea-Crisis (that 'the west' isn't allowed to complain because of Bosnia). Just because 'the west' interfered illegally in Bosnia, doesn't give Russia a free pass to do so as well.

I was just responding to the patronising tone of the comment above, showing how it's rarely the case that such manipulation is directly punished by the masses.

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#62

Post by hindsightbias »

pearjuice wrote: post #24

All my support goes to the Turkish government for trying to abrupt the Western propaganda and disrupting the influences of American secret national agencies. It is no secret that the protests and revolutions in Syria, Egypt, Tunis and the like were caused by internal fabrications from American soil so they could use the uproar for settling marionettes and proper satellite states instead of having to deal with nations…

The West wants to undermine their ally (Turkey) agaist Syria? Interesting theory. Or maybe one of Syria's allies has their own intel capacity...

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#63

Post by toyg »

nine_k wrote: post #48

The Internet was designed to withstand damage due to nuclear warfare and other external disruptions. It apparently was not designed to reliably withstand serious attacks of malicious third parties controlling some segments of it. Time to adapt.

The Internet certainly was; HTTP and DNS, not so much.

Note how it's not TCP/IP failing here.

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#64

Post by digitalengineer »

yulaow wrote: post #33
pearjuice wrote: post #24

All my support goes to the Turkish government for trying to abrupt the Western propaganda and disrupting the influences of American secret national agencies. It is no secret that the protests and revolutions in Syria, Egypt, Tunis and the like were caused by internal fabrications from American soil so they could use the uproar for settling marionettes and proper satellite states instead of having to deal with nations…

Personally I think this reasoning is totally bullshit. People have a brain and can easily discern and analyze the information they get from different sources. Internet, in this sense, is the main "method" to get information for gazzillion different sources, compare them, discuss with other people with other ideas and, in the end, come to a objective conclusion. Shut it down is not at all a counter-measure... rather I…

Isn't the saying something along the lines of "a person is smart but people are dumb"? It was proven there were NGO's stirring up things in Kiev. It was also proven they totally lost control and now we have armed militants (neonazi's?) even demonstrating their 'power' by showing up in parliament. (This made Putins say, now he can claim to protect the Russian minority).

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#65

Post by toyg »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #57
Joeboy wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of the "information wants to be free" and "the internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it" slogans of yesteryear. The internet isn't magic. There is no natural law that means it will always emerge victorious.

Well, it does "route around damage", but there's a difference between an infrastructure damage (be it a denial of service, or a tactical nuclear strike) and a continuous, intentional action of a sentient adversary. Unfortunately, conflating those two concepts is a common mistake when designing or thinking about systems.

TBH it's mostly about the fact that the "route around damage" really applies only to a very small stack. What does the browser do, to "route around damage"? What does a DNS client do? Very little, if anything. They were not built to "route around damage", they were built to do client/server.

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#66

Post by logfromblammo »

pearjuice wrote: post #24

All my support goes to the Turkish government for trying to abrupt the Western propaganda and disrupting the influences of American secret national agencies. It is no secret that the protests and revolutions in Syria, Egypt, Tunis and the like were caused by internal fabrications from American soil so they could use the uproar for settling marionettes and proper satellite states instead of having to deal with nations…

Your argument seems to be that the happenings in your locale are attributable to avaricious, power-mad sociopaths operating governments in other places. I should point out that, while this may be true, it does not rule out the hypothesis that avaricious, power-mad sociopaths are also operating the government that claims you as its subject.

While it is also true that the Internet is filled to the brim with lies, propaganda, jokes, sarcasm, pornography, and cute cat videos, it also contains some genuine facts. As I am well aware that certain employees of my own government are unable to locate their own buttocks with two full-time assistants and a 350-page illustrated instruction manual, I very much prefer that the determination of whether something I find on the network is worth seeing be left to me, and me alone.

Arguing for censorship is arguing that you are an idiot that needs to be protected from your own poor judgement. If you truly find yourself unable to use the Internet responsibly, please just disconnect yourself from it rather than advocating for its destruction.

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#67

Post by josephschmoe »

erichurkman wrote: post #9

I hope enough copies of whatever damning evidence the Turkish government wants to suppress are being disseminated outside of Turkey as well as inside the country. Long live Sneaker Net.

People really underestimate the power of the sneaker net. The fastest way to transmit data is by carrier pigeon.

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#68

Post by logfromblammo »

middleclick wrote: post #40
pearjuice wrote: post #24

All my support goes to the Turkish government for trying to abrupt the Western propaganda and disrupting the influences of American secret national agencies. It is no secret that the protests and revolutions in Syria, Egypt, Tunis and the like were caused by internal fabrications from American soil so they could use the uproar for settling marionettes and proper satellite states instead of having to deal with nations…

Poe's law?

Probably satire.

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#69

Post by epimenov »

toyg wrote: post #63
nine_k wrote: post #48

The Internet was designed to withstand damage due to nuclear warfare and other external disruptions. It apparently was not designed to reliably withstand serious attacks of malicious third parties controlling some segments of it. Time to adapt.

The Internet certainly was; HTTP and DNS, not so much. Note how it's not TCP/IP failing here.

You can make tcp/ip fail as well, just like Pakistan did back in 2008: http://www.renesys.com/2008/02/pakistan-hijacks-youtube-1/

Re: Turkish government takes down YouTube too

#70

Post by digitalengineer »

jann wrote: post #39
toyg wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, like US and UK populations voted out their chief warmongers pronto, once it came out that the rationale for getting into the Iraq war was fabricated... oh wait

I'm very sorry but I really don't like that argument. That doesn't make it any less ghastly for others to be like that as well. The argument you bring seems similar to what people say about the Crimea-Crisis (that 'the west' isn't allowed to complain because of Bosnia). Just because 'the west' interfered illegally in Bosnia, doesn't give Russia a free pass to do so as well.

Doesn't the us have the Monroe doctrine? It allows for the invasion of foreign country's when the us feels threatened right?
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