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Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

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Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#41

Post by pekk »

leccine wrote: post #32
sdfjkl wrote: post #7

It's not Flash that is dead, it's the whole concept of browser plugins. Too risky, too inconvenient, too often installed and then forgotten, never to receive security updates (or those that exist aren't installed because they prompt us about it far too often).

This is exactly why security conscious people don't use flash. Html is supposed to be a document and not an application. We created this Frankenstein with Flash, Java and JS to make HTML pages appear other than documents. The net result is that you need to install these plugins otherwise you can't get the full experience. The real question is why do we let people to abuse technology instead of using it well. I have d…

Just using Javascript also makes it the same kind of "frankenstein" - if you are just concerned about code running then Javascript is no better than Flash

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#43

Post by tbrock »

slacka wrote: post #17

For those not familiar with OpenFL, /u/larsiusprime posted a nice summary of how it's used: "OpenFL is is a programming API that mirrors the Flash API, but in the Haxe language. So you take your old ActionScript code and port it over to Haxe (very similar language, but with additional features). Then you also take your Flash-vector-art SWF files, and you load it with the Haxe SWF library. OpenFL ensures you can still…

So basically, the open source community made a better flash than Adobe did? That is rather amazing considering the resources of the respective groups.

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#44

Post by tomphoolery »

TomGullen wrote: post #11

> I could try HTML5, but that precludes releasing high-performance desktop-ready games for Steam. We develop Construct 2 ( https://www.scirra.com ) which is an HTML5 game engine. It can export to EXE via Node Webkit with very good performance, as well as the ability to export a multitude of mobile platforms as well. One game we're excited to see released in the near future made in Construct 2 is "Penelope": https://w…

Thank you. I was going to come in here and say "Look I don't know if there are any HTML5 games on Steam, but how hard could it really be to package your game up in a fork of Chromium or WebKit?"

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#45

Post by larsiusprime »

leccine wrote: post #32
sdfjkl wrote: post #7

It's not Flash that is dead, it's the whole concept of browser plugins. Too risky, too inconvenient, too often installed and then forgotten, never to receive security updates (or those that exist aren't installed because they prompt us about it far too often).

This is exactly why security conscious people don't use flash. Html is supposed to be a document and not an application. We created this Frankenstein with Flash, Java and JS to make HTML pages appear other than documents. The net result is that you need to install these plugins otherwise you can't get the full experience. The real question is why do we let people to abuse technology instead of using it well. I have d…

OpenFL is not a plugin.

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#46

Post by [deleted] »

woj wrote: post #36
phoboslab wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It always makes me happy to see my game engine mentioned here. Thank you! :) Just to chime in, I believe that HTML5 currently is as "cross-platform" as it can get, especially for games. Two examples made with Impact: - Olympia Rising[1] - this game recently had a successful kickstarter campaign and will be released for various desktop platforms and maybe more later. - XType Plus[2] - my own game coming to the Nintend…

Thanks for impactjs! I used it to develop this couple years ago: http://heartlight5.com Have fun!

[deleted]

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#47

Post by zacharypinter »

> I've been a stalwart Flash developer for 15 years, so nothing bothers me more than greatly exaggerated reports of Flash's premature demise.

...

> I've learned my lesson -- whatever my next platform is, no-one should be able to take it away from me.

There's an interesting side discussion here. It seems to me that the rate of substantial changes in technology/frameworks/ui design/etc is increasing such that the expectation of finding a platform that you can hold on to for 15 years is becoming untenable.

I worked with Flash (via Flex) for several years and found it to be one of the best UI frameworks I've ever developed with. I have yet to find an web framework that matches the productivity of MXML and databinding for standard sorts of UI's.

I also use emacs daily, which is a piece of software that's older than I am and still going strong.

That said, when it comes to staying on top of technology rather than being made obsolete by it, I have yet to find a better strategy than to try to "ride the wave".

HTML5 addresses a lot of cross-platform issues and has a lot of attention today so it's worth learning, but I don't expect what I learn today to last forever. If/when VR takes off, we might all be focusing on 3D frameworks and a wealth of new UI primitives to support that ecosystem. Or, maybe some other technology will take the dev community by storm and it'll be worth going that direction.

In short: moving with the major paradigm shifts seems more tenable than trying to find/predict the stack that will last the longest. Very curious to hear if others have similar or alternative thoughts.

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#48

Post by fritz_vd »

Awesome overview. It's fairly easy to start with. Especially for 2D game. It compiles to JS as well fairly painlessly. Some difficulties occur when your start using oldschool Flash stuff such as "BitmapData" etc. Or fonts. But other than that it's pretty great.

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#49

Post by nawitus »

ojii wrote: post #30
erichurkman wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least one major component is moving off of Flash: videos. Now, if you opt to forgo Flash on your device, the most you seem to miss are some games and annoying banner ads.

Unfortunately, as far as I know there's still no decent solution to stream video without flash (I'm talking Twitch et al here). Twitch is the only reason I still have flash on my computer (and not actually for watching games being streamed, but for the annual Desertbus event). Has the HTML5 video streaming improved at all over the past year?

There's Media Source Extensions, but it's a draft standard with limited support currently.

Re: Flash is dead, long live OpenFL

#50

Post by PhasmaFelis »

> I could try HTML5, but that precludes releasing high-performance desktop-ready games for Steam.

Oh Jesus Christ. Do not do this. "Flash" and "high-performance" do not ever belong in the same sentence. Binding of Isaac was a game that, visually, could have run on a Super Nintendo, but it chugged like a tired tortoise on a midrange 2010 laptop. I know Flash is popular, I know it's easy to develop with, but if you use it for "high-performance" game design you are cutting out a huge potential audience of low-end users, because it is miserably slow and inefficient. I should not need cutting-edge hardware to run a simple 2D game.

Edit: For vector games, at least. Raster games made with Flixel seem to run all right. But Flash's native vector implementation is Godawful and deserves to die.

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