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JDK 8 Release Notes

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141–150 of 314 posts

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#141
post #4

You know, I've been messing around with Java little lately. Nothing too fancy. It's actually not a bad language -- with a modern IDE it's actually pretty quick and breezy to work with. If the standard library was cleaned up and the warts were all removed and filled in, even if it broke compatibility (call it Java X or the Latte language or something) I'd be okay with that. There's too much old 90's cruft hanging arou…

@regex

I think a simple enough solution would be to introduce raw strings which is how regex is usually done in python.

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#142
post #85
post #4

You know, I've been messing around with Java little lately. Nothing too fancy. It's actually not a bad language -- with a modern IDE it's actually pretty quick and breezy to work with. If the standard library was cleaned up and the warts were all removed and filled in, even if it broke compatibility (call it Java X or the Latte language or something) I'd be okay with that. There's too much old 90's cruft hanging arou…

Java is the #1 language in the world. It's the best out there, period. http://jaxenter.com/java-is-the-world-s-1-programming-langua...

Popularity != Quality

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, actually, Java is a really bad language. It has a very complicated type system, but doesn't even allow you to express things like function composition or generic sums at the language level. Its syntax is stunningly verbose (e.g., no map literals; only now adding lambda literals; no type synonyms; no operator overloading). There is no macro system or method_missing or any other way of really extending the language…

> It has a very complicated type system, but doesn't even allow you to express things like function composition or generic sums at the language level. Yeah, sure, it doesn't have Haskell's . or algebraic datatypes, just like lots of other languages. I'm not sure what's complicated about the Java type system, but I suspect you're trying to say you don't like subtyping. Moving on... > Its syntax is stunningly verbose (…

> I'm not sure what's complicated about the Java type system

I assumed this was a reference to the unequal handling of "primitive" types vs Object types, with only the latter being able to be used with generics. Except for the weird "dual" object types which sortof are and sortof are not equivalents to the primitive types (int -> Integer, etc). WHich for methods needing to take actual primitives leads to having to do abominations of repetition such as http://www.docjar.com/docs/api/java/util/Arrays.html.

Some other bad things (not necessarily "complicated" but it does complicate the code that needs to be written):

Enumerations all have to have the same constructor params and therefore the same "shape". SOrt of defeats the purpose of enumerating ALTERNATIVES, I would say (this is part of the lack of sum types that was mentioned, though).

Others mentioned nullability. Some other things I didn't see others mention:

Botched covariance of arrays which leads to runtime failure where compile time should have been sufficient, http://k2java.blogspot.com/2011/07/parametrized-types-and-ar....

Some other minor things, such as botched clonability system, where Cloneable is a "marker" interface that doesn't tell you whether some type is really cloneable, a bizarre unforced error where a simple interface (you know, with an actual method called "clone") would have sufficed.

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#144
post #56
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was going to reply with exactly the same thing, and I'd add slf4j.

Because God knows, Java needs another logging framework. Seriously does ANYONE get any additional value out of the morass of crappy logging systems out there over and above System.out.println? Log4J is PARTICULARLY brain-damaged, with its refrain of "ooh, someone put a log4j.xml in their JAR (one of hundreds), that beats your log4j.properties.". Or SL4Js amazing performance of "1.6 doesn't work with Scala because of…

Yeah and I don't get why the loggers default to noop when they're not configured correctly. Here's a typical scenario:

I'm deep in the zone, half way through fixing something and it's not working. I start up my app and realize log4whatever can't find its configuration so it defaults to no logging. Now I need to unpop my mental stack all the way to switch gears so I can fix this logging configuration issue because for all I know the key to my problem is in the log message that log4whatever hides when it's in noop mode. Why not default to as verbose as possible?

From what I can tell, the majority of these crappy Java logging frameworks are made by this one guy who keeps on screwing up. Eventually he abandons ship and starts over again. log4j, logback and slf4j are all by the same guy.

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#145
post #95
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better light weight alternate is Netbeans 8 that also just got released and has full Java 8 support in addition to many many other features: https://netbeans.org/community/releases/80/

I'm not sure why you felt the need to add "a better light weight", why not just say "Netbeans also got Java 8 support"? This isn't the place to start a flamewar.

On account of it being better and more light weight? :o)

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#146
post #18
post #4

You know, I've been messing around with Java little lately. Nothing too fancy. It's actually not a bad language -- with a modern IDE it's actually pretty quick and breezy to work with. If the standard library was cleaned up and the warts were all removed and filled in, even if it broke compatibility (call it Java X or the Latte language or something) I'd be okay with that. There's too much old 90's cruft hanging arou…

A major cleanup of the Java libraries is scheduled for Java 9. The JVM actually does not surprise anyone who's been working with it for a while: it is downright the most performant, flexible and awesome runtime environment ever developed. I've been playing around with lots of languages and environments in my pretty long career and, in the past decade, have always come back to Java (or the JVM). It feels like driving…

Agreed, in fact what's surprising is that anyone thinks it's surprising that the JVM with its billions of man hours and primary usage in mission critical finance/banking/etc is anything but one of the most performant, scalable, robust, well-tooled platforms around.

>Aside from terrific performance, the JVM gives you the best concurrency platform out there (though not the easiest to use)

Though I'd probably still reserve that accolade for Erlang OTP/BEAM.

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#147
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Java is the #1 language in the world. It's the best out there, period. http://jaxenter.com/java-is-the-world-s-1-programming-langua...

Popularity != Quality

I don't think you can become a popular cross platform systems programming language without being pretty decent.

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#149
post #4

You know, I've been messing around with Java little lately. Nothing too fancy. It's actually not a bad language -- with a modern IDE it's actually pretty quick and breezy to work with. If the standard library was cleaned up and the warts were all removed and filled in, even if it broke compatibility (call it Java X or the Latte language or something) I'd be okay with that. There's too much old 90's cruft hanging arou…

Well you are basically quoting Joshua Bloch of Effective Java fame when he says "please don't abandon the JVM, a lot of work went into it"(My paraphrasing).

Re: JDK 8 Release Notes

#150
post #100

I'm very happy with the JVM in general, but I really, really, really wish they fixed the start up time. People compile Clojure down to Javascript for command line tools precisely because of this. lein takes annoyingly long, so I don't do it. I realize this is not a real concern for them for e.g. servers, but I wish they had some developer- or desktop-specific configuration that would start about as fast as a Python V…

Can you please give a use case of a program that a few hundred ms delay during startup would be an issue?
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