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Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

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Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#301

Post by madaxe_again »

jballanc wrote: post #45

The folks over at airliners.net have pointed out that the 777's collision avoidance system only works if both planes' transponders are turned on. That doesn't mean this scenario is impossible, but it does raise the level of sophistication required. Sadly, I feel like whatever happened, the amount of sophistication involved increasingly points toward the involvement of one or more state actors. If that's the case, I'm…

I'm looking at Russia, and thinking that it would be very convenient for them for Ukraine to drop off the news... which it largely did when this broke.

Now what could cause that - perhaps a good mystery. Everyone likes a good mystery.

Baikonur is a pretty f'ing good place to hide something like a 777, and is very proximal to the last possible position. Been there. Middle of nowhere. Airstrip is high security, remote, and has underground hangers. Local populace are very well versed in "I see nothing". It's also jurisdictionally weird, being a bit of Kaz rented to Russia as sovereign territory, meaning that any legal search would be very tricky to arrange to say the least.

Add that to the big old pile of theories.

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#302

Post by MPSimmons »

selimthegrim wrote: post #265
exelius wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or they were hijacking a plane to stuff it full of chemical weapons / radioactive material (think dirty bomb) with the intent of flying it over a major city and detonating it. It would be hard to do it in a western nation, but if you were aiming at a city near the "frontier" of India, Pakistan, etc. a bad actor could likely execute the plan before the jets they scramble could intercept the jet. There's a lot of bad s…

Er, if the ISI wanted a 777, there are much closer places to steal one from and repaint. http://www.piac.com.pk/

If you steal a plane off the ground, it's a stolen plane. If you steal a plane out of the sky, it "obviously" crashed, just like we all thought for the first four or five days of this.

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#303

Post by akumen »

yaeger wrote: post #12
akumen wrote: post #4

Good theory. Yours is as good as anyone's at this point in time. Incredible, how we think that our tech is so advanced yet a commercial jet can go completely missing. MH370 makes for an incredible setup to 'Lost'.

I think this whole thing could have been prevented if only the tracking systems could not have been turned off manually. Why is that even possible? An oversight? If you think about just how many liberties we passengers had to give up after 9/11 worldwide, why was this still there? We can't take any liquids on board anymore but if the pilot wants, he can make the plane disappear at will? Yeah, the liquid thing was rea…

There are legitimate reasons to have a manual on/off switch:

1. In case of electrical failure to extend battery charges for 2-way communication.

2. If the device goes nuts and is better off.

3. To be turned off so that it doesn't interfere with a backup transponder.

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#304

Post by akumen »

msantos wrote: post #55
akumen wrote: post #4

Good theory. Yours is as good as anyone's at this point in time. Incredible, how we think that our tech is so advanced yet a commercial jet can go completely missing. MH370 makes for an incredible setup to 'Lost'.

> MH370 makes for an incredible setup to 'Lost'. I believe it's more like Timtim's Flight 714 http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight_714

You sir, won the internet for me today :)

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#305

Post by toomuchtodo »

thekevan wrote: post #289
jballanc wrote: post #45

The folks over at airliners.net have pointed out that the 777's collision avoidance system only works if both planes' transponders are turned on. That doesn't mean this scenario is impossible, but it does raise the level of sophistication required. Sadly, I feel like whatever happened, the amount of sophistication involved increasingly points toward the involvement of one or more state actors. If that's the case, I'm…

"UPDATE - Monday, March 17, 2014 - 12:15 PM EST Some have raised the statement that TCAS doesn’t work if the transponder is disabled… this is only partially correct. Other planes TCAS would NOT see MH370 at all. MH370 would not actively query other planes as it’s transponder is off HOWEVER it could still listen to any transponder output from other planes that are actively transmitting. SQ68 would have been actively t…

> Even if TCAS on MH370 wasn’t working for some reason, an in-expensive portable ADS-B receiver paired with an iPad and Foreflight app would allow a pilot to receive the ADS-B output being transmitted by SQ68 at that time."

http://www.reddit.com/r/RTLSDR

That ADS-B receiver runs about $20-30.

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#306

Post by DanBC »

cube13 wrote: post #283
knowaveragejoe wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but I think what Herbig is saying is that the increased sophistication of assumptions means decreased likelihood that this was a deliberate hijacking. We get further away from Occam's razor in order to satisfy that. As of yet we haven't seen any group take responsibility, no claims of hostages or anything remotely indicative of this. So if it was taken by a terrorist group, where is the terrorism they plan to co…

This is the kind of target that would have someone claiming responsibility. The plane wasn't from a country that's known for disproportionate responses to attacks(i.e. the US or Russia). I would figure that if any group actually did pull this off, they'd be making public announcements that they took down the plane, or were holding it for ransom.

Aum Shinrikyo aerosolised and released anthrax for a week. They were caught. They didn't make any announcement about it. Announcing it a few days afterwards would have caused significant panic and distress.

(Luckily they used the "wrong" anthrax, so not much harm done).

The same organisation also did odd things in Australia. They made sarin and VX gas, tested that on sheep, and the. Used the gases in several assassinations.

They released sarin in Matsumoto, killing 8 people and harming 200. They didn't claim that attack.

Aum Shinrikyo are well funded, have smart people working for them, and are happy to murder people.

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#307

Post by frenchy »

venomsnake wrote: post #290
twistedpair wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Three cases of pilots committing suicide with big jets in the last few years. Silk Air 185, Egypt Air 990, LAM 470. So either (a) it's an act of war by another country or (b) the far simpler a pilot committed suicide. However, it if was a state actor, would you as the US tell people that? Wars cost trillions. Perhaps just sweep it under the rug.

If you want to kill yourself - you just fly the plane into the ground during landing or takeoff. It is way too elaborate to get to the no mans land and then fly 5 hours and crash somewhere.

I'm not at all an expert on the topic but I would guess that people who are willing to commit suicide are emotionally troubled and may not act in predictable or rational ways.

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#308

Post by ZoF »

LammyL wrote: post #250

This notion that mh370 was flying behind the Singapore jet to avoid radar is far fetched. Is the simple explanation much more likely that primary and secondary radar were both tracking the Singapore jet and the data wasn't matched properly? If the two jets were flying in tandem as you suggest, wouldn't you expect two hits on primary radar?

In theory if one plane ghosted the other by staying quite literally behind it (in relation to the radar, not behind it front to back) there would only be one blip.

Difficult to the point of high improbability? Methinks yes.

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#309

Post by ccarpenterg »

aestra wrote: post #254
ccarpenterg wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope you're wrong. If a state was involved that would mean that boarding a plane is extremely dangerous from now on. This case is really suspicious but I still think this was just an accident.

Not really... Nations (and other organizations) have been carrying out false flag operations since forever. In the 1960s there was Operation Northwoods - a plan by the US government to bomb US civilian aircraft and plant evidence it was Cuba who did it to justify invading Cuba. The Joint Chiefs of Staff signed off on it and it would have been implemented except JFK wouldn't sign off on it. So even if this had nation…

So what do you actually believe? That this was a false flag operation and that the plane is fine and parked somewhere, perhaps it never took off?

It's hard to believe to say the least. If such scenario does exist what makes you think that you can figure it out by yourself?

Re: Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68/SQ68 (another 777)?

#310

Post by twistedpair »

venomsnake wrote: post #290
twistedpair wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Three cases of pilots committing suicide with big jets in the last few years. Silk Air 185, Egypt Air 990, LAM 470. So either (a) it's an act of war by another country or (b) the far simpler a pilot committed suicide. However, it if was a state actor, would you as the US tell people that? Wars cost trillions. Perhaps just sweep it under the rug.

If you want to kill yourself - you just fly the plane into the ground during landing or takeoff. It is way too elaborate to get to the no mans land and then fly 5 hours and crash somewhere.

Lookup Silk Air 185. Pilot went to lengths to disable CVR and FDR so that there was no record of him incapacitating the FO and directing the plane into the ground. He had an insurance policy he took out that day. Some people don't want to have a wikipedia article saying they murdered 238 people. So, fly it into the middle of no where and no one will ever know. It's working so far.
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