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Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

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Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#961

Post by grifpete »

grifpete wrote: post #837
gvb wrote: post #773

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GitHub cannot defend itself in public. It is a multimillion dollar company with a very disgruntled ex-employee charging them of sexual discrimination. You can bet their lawyers are saying in tones that cannot be ignored to not say anything until and unless it goes to trial.

Of course they can defend themselves in public. Corporations engage PR firms to manage that expertly for them all the time. And ironically, whether this goes to trial or not, the worse the objective case for Github the more confident you can be that their lawyers will be telling them to say little or nothing. Expect a very bland statement to appear shortly about how much they love and value their female employees. We…

I am favorably impressed by the statement recently issued by Github.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#962

Post by smoofles »

girvo wrote: post #383
froo wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try getting sternly lectured for 10 minutes because because you held the door open for a stranger to be polite. That's when you know shit gotten real. For the record, I routinely hold open doors for people that I know are behind me and are leaving/entering a building. It surprised me to know end to get yelled at for it.

I had that happen, so I laughed. Then she got really angry... doesn't stop me, though. I hold the door for everyone, because it's polite , not because someone is whatever gender.

First time I had that happen I quickly shut the door in the young lady’s face. Didn’t hit her, but it fell in place and she had to open it again herself.

She was pretty unhappy about that as well, incidentally.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#963

Post by grifpete »

greenrd wrote: post #486
jmspring wrote: post #11

If allegations of non-employee/founder wife scenario is true, I would hope the board shows said founder the door. Beyond being in bad taste, it's exposing the company to some serious liabilities...

What's the big deal? I am not a lawyer and I have no idea of the issues involved here, but surely if she was now made an employee and given a salary of $0, the fact that she was a significant investor (via her husband's shares) would make her relatively high-ranking within the company. So yes legally the fact that she didn't have that piece of paper (an employment contract) might matter, but why should it matter mora…

a) you can't fix the problems of the past by giving her a job now b) being a significant investor doesn't make you 'relatively high-ranking in the company.' You are either an employee with a high ranking job, or an investor. If you have no executive functions and are just an investor you are not entitled to intervene in day to day affairs unbidden. c) It matters morally because even if she had the paper that would not entitle her to talk and harass an employee with the tacit support and protection of a senior member of the company.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#964

Post by Fuxy »

graycat wrote: post #956
Fuxy wrote: post #943

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may hurt githubs reputation a bit. I'm quite certain some women in technology will avoid them now but the reality is this has nothing to do with sexism. No guy would ever bother to create this much drama. This is clearly a girl problem. I got one thing to say to that github founder man up and keep your wife in check. What is she doing there to begin with anyway? Doesn't she have anything better to do then attempt…

> What is she doing there to begin with anyway? Commonly wives help their husbands with the career or company of the husband with a lot of help for the husband and nothing wrong. Of course, in this case the wife blew it, but maybe she was a pest mostly just for the woman of the OP so that others in the company didn't much care.

I honestly hope you are right and she was honestly trying to help however my gut tells me it's all about appearances with this one.

Just the fact that she was told to leave her alone and she completely ignored that request leads me to believe her husband has no control over her and she's just a loose cannon.

Worse still he might actually back her up when people complain which is just encouraging this bad behavior.

I looks to me that she is sabotaging the company and bringing a lot of drama to the office instead of helping him.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#965

Post by MartinCron »

mst wrote: post #953
MartinCron wrote: post #864

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not a gendered problem, this is a 'loud brash people' versus 'quieter nicer people' problem It's my hope that having a more diverse workplace will help the "quiet nice people" with and without Y chromosomes.

Diversity exists on many axis, and personality types are an important form of it just as much as gender is. I find your use of 'more diverse' to mean 'more gender balanced' distasteful, because privileging gender roles as important like that is a huge part of the problem.

You misinterpret what I mean and find it distasteful? I am overcome with apathy.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#966

Post by einhverfr »

ZoF wrote: post #860
tomp wrote: post #598

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does that entire paragraph not just objectify the wife Objectify is a really overused term that has lost all relevant meaning. How can saying that someone is better than you at something possibly objectify that person? Maybe I'm overly sensible as well, but it's really sad that this is where PC has led us.

"...one of your most valuable business resources is your wife." That's the objectifying part imo.... Would you disagree?

In that case, isn't "Human Resources" a department whose entire reason for existence is to objectify everyone equally?

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#967

Post by mst »

MartinCron wrote: post #965
mst wrote: post #953

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Diversity exists on many axis, and personality types are an important form of it just as much as gender is. I find your use of 'more diverse' to mean 'more gender balanced' distasteful, because privileging gender roles as important like that is a huge part of the problem.

You misinterpret what I mean and find it distasteful? I am overcome with apathy.

If that wasn't what you meant then your original comment could've been reduced to "I agree".

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#968

Post by einhverfr »

acjohnson55 wrote: post #641
einhverfr wrote: post #510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It really surprises me that somebody can get away with such destructive behaviour as reverting someone else's commits without reasonable cause. What justification is there for not firing on the spot anybody who puts their own personal vendettas over the good of the project? And yet it happens everywhere. The question is what narratives can be told about it more than what actually happened.

I've never been anywhere where this sort of behavior happened. If management can't nip things like that in the bud, they aren't doing their jobs.

I have seen vendettas handled in crazy ways in a few different places. People figure out what they can get away with.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#970

Post by mcv »

Fuxy wrote: post #943
graycat wrote: post #877

Looks to me that the wife of the founder was doing something that is common, 'protecting her man'. She was getting a bit carried away and using poor judgment and was apparently quite naive about business, but such things are not rare. So, it was two women fighting, very emotionally, and that's not rare either. The founder needed to keep his wife 'at home' or some such, but these days women resent such 'controls'. So,…

It may hurt githubs reputation a bit. I'm quite certain some women in technology will avoid them now but the reality is this has nothing to do with sexism. No guy would ever bother to create this much drama. This is clearly a girl problem. I got one thing to say to that github founder man up and keep your wife in check. What is she doing there to begin with anyway? Doesn't she have anything better to do then attempt…

> No guy would ever bother to create this much drama.

Selection bias. No guy would ever be treated like that.

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