Update on Julie Horvath's Departure • Hacker News Board

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#91

Post by phreanix » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:34 AM UTC

Bahamut wrote: post #12

_delirium wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was also my first reaction. I don't know enough about crisis-management-style PR to second-guess their response. I often have the suspicion that founders are not taking the best course of action, but this response seems to avoid the obvious pitfalls.

This was also my first reaction as well - the real question is how they followup this response, but this is the only correct move at this juncture.

I think the follow up will be more critical, especially the public explanation. That will have the potential to either strengthen GH's credibility or destroy it.

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#92

Post by BCM43 » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:34 AM UTC

sitharus wrote: post #28

laureny wrote: post #21

> We know we have to take action and have begun a full investigation. While that’s ongoing, and effective immediately, the relevant founder has been put on leave, as has the referenced GitHub engineer. Pretty much a full admission that everything that Julie said is true. This is great news, but putting these people on leave seems to be too nice. It's clear that these two people obey ethics that are in direct oppposit…

> > We know we have to take action and have begun a full investigation. While that’s ongoing, and effective immediately, the relevant founder has been put on leave, as has the referenced GitHub engineer. > Pretty much a full admission that everything that Julie said is true. > This is great news, but putting on leave seems to be too nice. It's clear that these two people obey ethics that are in direct oppposition to…

>It's pretty standard practice to place employees on paid leave while serious complaints are investigated.

Employees? Sure. Founders? I've not heard of that before.

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#93

Post by mikehearn » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:34 AM UTC

laureny wrote: post #21

> We know we have to take action and have begun a full investigation. While that’s ongoing, and effective immediately, the relevant founder has been put on leave, as has the referenced GitHub engineer. Pretty much a full admission that everything that Julie said is true. This is great news, but putting these people on leave seems to be too nice. It's clear that these two people obey ethics that are in direct oppposit…

> Doesn't appear so. They did get an HR person, but an experienced one? Not a chance. No experienced HR person would have let any of that get as far as it got. That HR person should probably be put on leave or be fired as well.

The HR person has been on the job for a minimum of 31 business days and a maximum of 53. Horvath joined two years ago. Unless you are a GitHub insider, you currently are working off knowledge from a single source in which the information was provided by a person with a specific agenda. It is malicious to call for the HR person's job given your almost complete dearth of information.

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#94

Post by pistle » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:34 AM UTC

jw2013 wrote: post #58

laureny wrote: post #21

> We know we have to take action and have begun a full investigation. While that’s ongoing, and effective immediately, the relevant founder has been put on leave, as has the referenced GitHub engineer. Pretty much a full admission that everything that Julie said is true. This is great news, but putting these people on leave seems to be too nice. It's clear that these two people obey ethics that are in direct oppposit…

>>> This narrows down the choices: the "founder" who is the cause for all this drama is either PJ Hyett or Tom Preston-Werner. Any guess?

Tom is married. Is PJ?

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#95

Post by bdcravens » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:35 AM UTC

The founder’s wife discussed in the media reports has never had hiring or firing power at GitHub and will no longer be permitted in the office.

The fact that she was married to someone who did have hiring or firing power and WAS permitted in the office means she DID have (defacto) hiring or firing power.

I wonder what the ramifications are, legal-wise? Obviously the founder could be sued, especially if he was allowing someone who wasn't an employee to harass. I suspect A16Z will waste no time putting distance between themselves and the (allegedly) guilty founder. In the end, this wife's jealousy could end up costing her family 10s or 100s of millions of dollars.

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#96

Post by tw268 » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:35 AM UTC

comrh wrote: post #69

tw268 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting mad at people having harmless fun isn't normal, but on feminism it is...

Yeah, rage against feminism... the radical notion that women are people.

Feminism is a cultural Marxist ideology which tries to explain the world through the lens of class conflict - an overclass (male) which is oppressive and therefore evil and an underclass (female) which is oppressed and therefore good. This is why it is not considered oppression when men die young or go to prison more often than women and it is not a problem when men are underrepresented in higher ed - men can't be oppressed by definition.

In a perfectly fair world, men and women would behave differently due to comparative advantage and specialization based on sexual dimorphism. Feminism, in seeking an equal world, denies reality and quite a bit of science. Also, like most Marx-derived groups, feminists are humorless killjoys

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#97

Post by dkersten » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:35 AM UTC

stevenelliottjr wrote: post #47

Pretty ridiculous, I'm sure she'll land on her feet but these startup cultures are a disaster. Hula hoops? No clear management of any kind? I'm all for freedom of expression and all that but try and act like an adult for once in your life and put the hula hoops down.

What is wrong with hula hoops?

I have (adult) friends who dance for fun, play with hula hoops, play with poi balls and lots of other things. There is nothing wrong with these things.

No clear management of any kind is a big problem, but the rest of what you say is, as you put it, pretty ridiculous.

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#98

Post by Bahamut » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:35 AM UTC

phillmv wrote: post #54

laureny wrote: post #21

> We know we have to take action and have begun a full investigation. While that’s ongoing, and effective immediately, the relevant founder has been put on leave, as has the referenced GitHub engineer. Pretty much a full admission that everything that Julie said is true. This is great news, but putting these people on leave seems to be too nice. It's clear that these two people obey ethics that are in direct oppposit…

>Surely they don't want them back? People make mistakes; they seem to get a lot of other things right, so maybe the relationship is salvageable - and all he needs is some time off. >Doesn't appear so. They did get an HR person, but an experienced one? Not a chance. No experienced HR person would have let any of that get as far as it got. That HR person should probably be put on leave or be fired as well. Jeez. They h…

People make mistakes, but as far as it appears, this was a colossal failure of leadership.

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#99

Post by lucisferre » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:35 AM UTC

pekk wrote: post #31

almightygod wrote: post #26

This whole incident is sad. It's incredibly sad for Julie, for everyone at GitHub, for the founders, and for the alleged "crazy" founder wife who was banned from a company she probably sacrificed a lot for

I'm surprised nobody sees sexism in the way that the wife has been stigmatized.

So... you don't see sexism in the way she behaved?

Re: Update on Julie Horvath's Departure

#100

Post by JeremyMorgan » Mon, Mar 17, 2014, 3:36 AM UTC

Recoil42 wrote: post #75

laureny wrote: post #21

> We know we have to take action and have begun a full investigation. While that’s ongoing, and effective immediately, the relevant founder has been put on leave, as has the referenced GitHub engineer. Pretty much a full admission that everything that Julie said is true. This is great news, but putting these people on leave seems to be too nice. It's clear that these two people obey ethics that are in direct oppposit…

>Pretty much a full admission that everything that Julie said is true. No, it isn't. It's standard operating procedure pretty much everywhere to put employees on leave while an investigation is conducted. It shouldn't be construed as an admission at all.

No but the apology says a lot...