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Are Malls Over?

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Re: Are Malls Over?

#101

Post by bane »

earino wrote: post #98
bane wrote: post #81

This is really an important question as malls are usually massive holders of lots of valuable real estate in many towns. Where I live, there are...maybe around a dozen proper stereotypical malls within an hour drive. Of those, the two malls I literally grew up in have had very different trajectories. The one next to my highschool is a veritable empty shell. I think it sits at 40% occupancy, with entire wings boarded…

You just described Nashville, TN perfectly. I don't know where you are describing, but you just gave a fantastic breakdown of the fall of the Hickory Hollow Mall and the rise and plateauing of either Green Hills or Cool Springs. It was a little uncanny. If it isn't Nashville, TN then this is a spectacular repeating pattern and now I hope I can find some good data sets regarding mall occupancy somewhere that I can vis…

Nope, not Nashville. About 750 miles East of there in the D.C. area.

Re: Are Malls Over?

#102

Post by kunai »

ams6110 wrote: post #43
badman_ting wrote: post #13

I don't go to them much anymore, but every time I do, I notice what a strange place it is. The stores are mostly bad, the food is of course terrible, very limited natural light, the list goes on. I can't imagine what "experience" we all thought we were enjoying in these grayboxes for so many years. True, there is a human need to congregate. But why do it in there? -- There is a reluctance among posters here to consid…

I can't imagine what "experience" we all thought we were enjoying in these grayboxes for so many years. The indoor shopping mall was, initially, a huge convenience. You could drive to one place, park once (usually for free), and visit a variety of shops in climate-controlled comfort (nice in rainy/winter seasons or hot summers). Most people found this preferable to driving all over town or even to a central downtown…

This is the perfect characterization of the demise of malls that I can think of. They fill a niche that just isn't needed anymore.

Sad. I miss my local arcade and video stores... there's only one video store left and the arcade closed up shop back in 2008.

I wish people would get off their asses for once and experience life! Convenience isn't everything. You don't make memories by sitting in front of a black rectangular slab with buttons and menus to choose from, you make memories from experiences. Like going places.. walking. Biking. Breathing. Seeing.

If we're not using all 5 senses I think there's no point in doing something.

Re: Are Malls Over?

#103

Post by dylz »

tsunamifury wrote: post #20

Forcing shopping activity and gathering into indoor brutalist buildings is dying, shopping centers are not. Look at union sq, 4th st, walnut creek, and many others in the sf bay. All are stronger than ever by offering very high end retail mixed with high quality independent offerings and unique chef-driven eateries. What people have abandoned is indoor, stale, sunlight less, copycat malls with the same awful pizza an…

Half of the reason I go to Westfield Mall is because of the food court.

If it was the standard mcdonalds-unrecognisable foodcourt chicken with different sauce-etc, I would hate it.

Re: Are Malls Over?

#105

Post by dylz »

untog wrote: post #23

NYTimes had an article a few days ago[1] about Sbarro's bankruptcy that touched on this topic - basically, Sbarro bet big on shopping mall food courts, and that bet has not paid off. But the more interesting part is at the end - as shopping malls become less desirable, rents will go down. This could lead to a radical reinvention of what a mall looks and feels like. So malls as we know them might be dead, but "the mal…

I want to say that maybe Sbarro charging $5-8 for a single slice of pizza might also be partial killer, especially in mall food courts where there are generic other selections for far far less.

Re: Are Malls Over?

#106

Post by WiseWeasel »

sliverstorm wrote: post #74
mgkimsal wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

agreed. back in the 80s, the closest mall to me was pretty good - a decent mix of entertainment stores (music, games) and arcades, and water slide for a while, movie theater, and a decent mix of food (well, some of the better food was anchor restaurants in the parking lot). My recollection is there was a lot of natural light on sunny days - large glass sections in the ceiling structure let in quite a lot of light. I…

The indoor style exists because of extreme weather. I personally suspect California got indoor shopping malls back then because most everywhere else had indoor malls too- and they had indoor malls for the same reason they have indoor highschools.

Inland central and southern California need air-conditioned spaces to escape the summer heat. Coastal, not so much.

Or were you referring to the consumer productivity lost studying the grass or feeding squirrels and pigeons rather than paying attention to the fabulous product offerings in the mall curriculum? God forbid people obtain value without anyone profiting; think of the children!

Re: Are Malls Over?

#107

Post by cmbaus »

ams6110 wrote: post #71
blahedo wrote: post #62

I'd like to mention three malls that don't purely fit the "greybox" model and may point to a likely future for malls in general. - West Edmonton Mall (Edmonton, AB). In one sense, it is the mother of all greybox malls, surrounded by an asphalt moat. But: it's accessible via local transit, and it's very much in the model of an artificial downtown: it contains hotels, apartments, a hockey rink, an aquarium, and a varie…

Combining residential spaces with malls is an interesting idea. There are a lot of builing codes that now require ground-floor retail on any residential buildings over a certain number of floors, but I've never seen or thought about revitalizing malls by adding a residential component. One downside would be that the parking starts to get taken up by residents rather than shoppers.

I took a business meeting in Houston one time, and my colleague kept telling me that the office was "in the mall." That seemed very odd to me, but there was a massive office building attached to the mall. Not a bad idea I guess considering the summer weather in Houston.

Re: Are Malls Over?

#108

Post by trekky1700 »

I think the American model of malls may be over. The model where there are crazy numbers of huge malls everywhere, even in relatively small populations. But malls are still hugely popular.

In Canada, where we have a lot less malls, they seem to be growing more popular. With renovations and extensions being built to attract and accommodate more shoppers. But there aren't that many major malls here, and they stick to major population areas. I'm always surprised the size of malls in small towns when I visit the US. Northwood, Ohio has a population of 5,000. That doesn't seem like it could sustain a mall the size described, even if you include the surrounding area and assume there's no other malls in the area.

I think the model will change, but malls will stay around for a long time. You'll have larger malls servicing more population, rather than malls for every town.

Re: Are Malls Over?

#109

Post by edj »

tsunamifury wrote: post #20

Forcing shopping activity and gathering into indoor brutalist buildings is dying, shopping centers are not. Look at union sq, 4th st, walnut creek, and many others in the sf bay. All are stronger than ever by offering very high end retail mixed with high quality independent offerings and unique chef-driven eateries. What people have abandoned is indoor, stale, sunlight less, copycat malls with the same awful pizza an…

Forcing shopping activity and gathering into indoor brutalist buildings is dying, shopping centers are not. Look at union sq, 4th st, walnut creek, and many others in the sf bay. All are stronger than ever by offering very high end retail mixed with high quality independent offerings and unique chef-driven eateries.

Exactly.

Take for example the Galleria Vittorio Emanuele II in Milan[1]. It's in the city center, it's visually spectacular, it's unique, and it's a fun place to visit, eat lunch, window shop, or spend (too much) money. It's been around for 150 years which indicates that this is a sustainable model for a shopping mall in a dense & vibrant city.

1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galleria_Vittorio_Emanuele_II

Re: Are Malls Over?

#110

Post by ulfw »

kalleboo wrote: post #99
dageshi wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably the climate? I'd imagine in summer Singapore and KL are ferociously humid and hot?

Even outdoor malls in Singapore have air conditioning http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarke_Quay

That's not a mall. It's a collection of restaurants (mostly for tourists). Not a single shop there.
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