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Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

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Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similarly, all the CS grads from Berkeley have BA's with lots of general education breadth requirements (EECS students have BS's).

If I could afford to continue and get a 4 year CS degree, I'd prefer myself to get a BA, or get a CS degree at a non engineering school.

Right I think that in a lot of ways it's actually an advantage to do CS at a Liberal Arts school. The key point to this article seems to be that you can always learn to code regardless of what you've learned in the past.

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#22
I'm interested to see, as better systems for teaching coding develop, popularity and awareness of its accessibility builds, it begins to go mainstream, and the marketplace becomes more competitive and wages decline, is, will the oldguard agitate for economic protection?

Edit: From the sounds of things, it's going to be very interesting:

Dan Melton, deputy chief technology officer at Granicus, a San Francisco-based startup that puts government data in the cloud, has hired two students with humanities backgrounds from App Academy. He said he looks for those students because they’re able to work better with other programmers and clients and understand the larger meaning of the work.

"We already have a lot of software whiz kids," Melton said. "We like to hire people who are interested in public affairs and civic engagement."

Sounds like it's going to be quite the culture change.

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#23
post #8

The problem with this title is that in the reference, "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel", the character actually has something that's relevant to his travels.

Programming is writing.

I have a BA in CS from a liberal arts school and I completely agree. Nothing in math or computer science is "discovered," but we're just learning and then writing a long narrative documenting the beauty and truth of the Universe. (Some people just have a stick up their a$$ because they happen to have done time to please someone else in either ivory tower or other powers, to think that what they do is better than shoveling snow).

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#24

This is a real pet peeve of mine, but "Liberal Arts" is not synonymous with "Humanities": http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/liberal%20arts > College or university curriculum aimed at imparting general knowledge and developing general intellectual capacities, in contrast to a professional, vocational, or technical curriculum. ... In modern colleges and universities, the liberal arts include the study of litera…

This is true, and as a potential undergrad my leaning was to an "engineering" school, but all three of my daughters ended up at "Small Liberal Arts Colleges", one with a Physics degree, one with a Biology degree, and the third will probably end up with a creative writing/economics degree. So two of them at least, very much 'hard' science and all very employable.

To the article's point though, coding has become a much more important vocational skill than it was. I really do think there should be a fourth skill set in primary school education reading, writing, mathematics, and computer programming.

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#25
> If a 10-year-old can become an ace web programmer, why can’t a liberal arts graduate?

Most 10-year-olds can't become ace web programmers (well, given an infinite time horizon, maybe they can, but then they aren't 10-year-olds anymore.)

For, largely completely different reasons, most liberal arts graduates probably can't either.

Of course, some can (I think I'm a pretty decent programmer, and my degree is a BA in Political Science. Then again, I was a programming long before I got that degree -- I might have even been a 10-year-old web programmer, if not necessarily an ace one, if the web existed when I was 10.)

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#26
The biggest issue with the article is

"Last March, he enrolled in App Academy, a 12-week web development program with locations in San Francisco and New York, and found a job coding within three weeks of interviewing. In his new position as a web application engineer at Yola, a San Francisco-based website building company, Morrison says he earns considerably more than what he had made doing administrative work."

Same thing was happening before the crash of 2000, people would take a month long course and then get jobs based on that course. I ask everyone what is driving up the valuations, and to look critically into the future. As soon as the companies that have the large valuations (Twitter,Facebook,etc.) start to post negative growth you will see an exodus.

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#27

The problem with this title is that in the reference, "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel", the character actually has something that's relevant to his travels.

> The problem with this title is that in the reference, "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel", the character actually has something that's relevant to his travels.

Surely the reference is to the saying "Have Gun, Will Travel" (to which "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel" was also a reference) which was popularly used to mean "I am prepared for anything", which is exactly the theoretical point behind a liberal arts degree (though not specifically a degree with a major in the humanities, though the latter are generally also the former, and the article seems to use them interchangeably; "liberal arts" is orthogonal to the major field of study.)

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similarly, all the CS grads from Berkeley have BA's with lots of general education breadth requirements (EECS students have BS's).

If I could afford to continue and get a 4 year CS degree, I'd prefer myself to get a BA, or get a CS degree at a non engineering school.

At most LACs, you can't get a BS degree. With that being side, my experience with liberal arts CS education (at Wesleyan) is ironically that it was too much CS because "liberal arts is suppose to be self-enrichment and theory". We went into a lot of theory and math (e.g., functional language, language design, automata, algorithm proof of correctness) and even the "practicum" courses was fairly academic (information theory analysis on genomic data, cryptography) and not "web development" or "J2EE".

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#29

> If a 10-year-old can become an ace web programmer, why can’t a liberal arts graduate? Brain plasticity. Next.

I've never found these "brain plasticity" arguments very compelling. I had no motivation or context for learning when I was young (0-20) and while I might have done well in school tests and read a lot of books, I don't think I really absorbed anything in any depth, or thought in any particularly interesting or challenging ways - I certainly never achieved anything which would have required so much willpower and focus as learning to program modern computers.

And now that I am older (mid-20s) and my brain is supposedly less plastic, but I have motivation, context and determination in abundance, I feel like I am really learning and developing for the first time in my life.

Re: Have Liberal Arts Degree, Will Code

#30
post #15
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Programming is writing.

Despite the flurry of Stunk&White analogies, I actually found the two activities to be quite distinct. I think in part because language is much more general (you could say "lose") and because programming exhibit concepts that are nowhere to be found in language (even at the "language" level, programming idioms have little to do with actual idioms).

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