Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

facebook.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 103 posts

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#51

Post by Zigurd »

julespitt wrote: post #39
Zigurd wrote: post #30

Facebook was listed as one of the companies participating in PRISM, with a specific start date. None of the denials or other announcements made by any of the companies the NSA seemed pretty sure were collaborating addressed why they appeared on that list. Until there is a good explanation for why the NSA thinks they were collaborating, denials ring pretty hollow.

It's not clear from the slides that the companies were "participating" at all. Further Snowden leaks showed that the NSA was cracking large internet companies' internal systems communications. PRISM doesn't necessarily need their cooperation at all.

Then why list specific companies and dates?

Either the companies on the PRISM list are willingly collaborating, or NSA bribed one or more employees, or NSA attacked their infrastructure.

If it wasn't willing cooperation, then the PRISM companies have a security breach to solve. None of them have said whether they have such a breach or not.

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#52

Post by [deleted] »

sremani wrote: post #42
balls187 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're leaving government because the President of the US won't take your phone call? Did you quit school because your name wasn't in the textbooks?

This is a very reductive logic, primarily focused on trolling. I hope you are not a dim-wit like the posts suggests you are.

[deleted]

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#53

Post by quangv »

rhizome wrote: post #24
zaidf wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's just illuminating who the government listens to If Obama and the gov actually listened to Zuck, the problem would be fixed. Heck at this point, it is not too farfetched to think that parts of the government don't listen to the President, even.

Zuck is the wrong person to make entreaties to the President about this because it doesn't affect Zuck personally. As far as the Executive Branch is concerned, Zuck is just expressing an opinion about policy the way an airline CEO might about the FAA: as a business concern, not a legal nor civil liberties one. Obama already knows that the only thing Zuck is talking about is money, not people.

I don't think Zuck is talking about money, but freedom. Sure maybe it's freedom to make money, but it's also freedom to express yourself.

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#54

Post by julespitt »

Zigurd wrote: post #51
julespitt wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not clear from the slides that the companies were "participating" at all. Further Snowden leaks showed that the NSA was cracking large internet companies' internal systems communications. PRISM doesn't necessarily need their cooperation at all.

Then why list specific companies and dates? Either the companies on the PRISM list are willingly collaborating, or NSA bribed one or more employees, or NSA attacked their infrastructure. If it wasn't willing cooperation, then the PRISM companies have a security breach to solve. None of them have said whether they have such a breach or not.

Right, I was just pointing out the possibility of your latter two options. There was also the possibility that PRISM was just a database of formal, court-ordered information.

I wish we had even more technical details.

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#55

Post by johnnyg »

Zikes wrote: post #27
johnnyg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How should they do it? Do you listen to everyone equally? Can it even be done?

I'm pretty sure listening to everyone equally is the definition of democracy.

One person, one vote does not mean equal influence per citizen.

I think "listen" deals in influence where as yes, one vote per citizen deals with democracy.

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#57

Post by higherpurpose »

Enough with these PR stunts, Mark. Put your money where your mouth is. Put your company where your mouth is. Add end to end encryption for your users chats, and encrypt everything as much as possible, to the highest security standards, and end-to-end wherever possible (like for FB chat and Whatsapp, where you could use the TextSecure ratchet).

Until then, all of your "calls for privacy" are not worth the digital paper they are being written on.

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#58

Post by balls187 »

sremani wrote: post #42
balls187 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're leaving government because the President of the US won't take your phone call? Did you quit school because your name wasn't in the textbooks?

This is a very reductive logic, primarily focused on trolling. I hope you are not a dim-wit like the posts suggests you are.

Troll fail.

Also: Arguing by ad hominem.

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#59

Post by rhizome »

quangv wrote: post #53
rhizome wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zuck is the wrong person to make entreaties to the President about this because it doesn't affect Zuck personally. As far as the Executive Branch is concerned, Zuck is just expressing an opinion about policy the way an airline CEO might about the FAA: as a business concern, not a legal nor civil liberties one. Obama already knows that the only thing Zuck is talking about is money, not people.

I don't think Zuck is talking about money, but freedom. Sure maybe it's freedom to make money, but it's also freedom to express yourself.

He already gets all the freedom he wants. Yes, I'm questioning not only his effectiveness, but his motivations.

He consequently simply may not be personally capable of having a freedom-oriented effect here. Said another say, he's a new-money kid, how much power can he really have?

Re: Zuckerberg Expresses Frustration Over Surveillance

#60

Post by rhizome »

zachrose wrote: post #16
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #7

I've called President Obama to express my frustration over the damage the government is creating for all of our future. This is why I am leaving government. I am about the same age as Zuck and have been working in government at many levels for about 12 years now and I work with people who have been working policy for over 40 years. The president couldn't care less what most of us think think...but because Zuck has sh…

It's not just because Zuckerburg has personal wealth. It's also because Facebook directly employs thousands of people, pays corporate taxes, enables new markets that rely on Facebook, and sells advertising to all those other corporations. His age has nothing to do with it.

Here's a thought experiment: what damage would be done if Facebook up and disappeared tomorrow? To society, to business, to the economy, whatever.

I'll take the "almost none" position, comparable to the season finale of "Friends."

Post reply on HN