Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 34 posts

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#11

Post by artharrison »

carlosdaniel wrote: post #7

Sounds like a case where you would usually push through by yourself, but given what happened last time I think you would be better getting some extra help and getting the product out sooner. I know a couple of outsourcing companies so I can give you a few pointers, good companies have NDAs and other contracts in place to protect you and your IP, usually they have US presence and they have workers on aligned timezones…

Would love that info - at least it would give me some concrete examples of what's available. I definitely have a budget -- willing to invest in the idea & no longer a starving student, so I certainly wouldn't want to be going the rock-bottom cheap route. Thanks.

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#12

Post by sixQuarks »

I'm basically in the same situation. Here is the solution I found that is working for me.

I'm assuming you have a clear vision for your product/service. You're going to have to take the lead on owning the product, there's no getting around this. There's almost no chance you're going to find a co-founder that's going to handle the product/development, etc while you focus on marketing. I've tried and each time has ended badly. I advise against co-founders unless you know the person well and have worked with them in the past.

Here's the key to getting something developed in as little time and effort as possible. Start with the design. What the user will see when they come to the site. Don't worry about the backend at all.

Search on Dribble for designers - they don't have to be front-end developers. Actually better if they're not (cheaper). For more affordable quality designers, search eastern europe/russia.

Contact a bunch of designers, see if they're available and what their rates are. See how quickly they respond, etc. Select 3 or 4 and give each one the same first task. It should be something that takes 2-3 hours. It could be taking a sketched mockup, polishing it up, etc. After each one has completed this, you pick the one you feel was the best.

A lot of good designers know good front-end developers. You can find one through the designer. If not, you can do the same process on odesk for both front-end and back-end developers.

This is the process I use after a lot of trial and error, and it works the best for me.

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#13

Post by artharrison »

charlieirish wrote: post #9

Ruthlessly strip out all features until hurts. Then build it yourself. Launch. Rinse and Repeat. Put up a landing page now to gauge interest and start the marketing effort by building a list.

Yeah, that's absolutely what I've done in the past / will do again if I head this route. (Truthfully speaking though, with the time limits, it was the ruthlessly stripped down version that took me 9 month). As I said, I'm a competent hacker, but even full-time, I'm nowhere near my dev friends and designer friends who breeze through some of the data structure design aspects I'd end up meddling with for a week ...

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#14

Post by osivertsson »

jason_slack wrote: post #6

Build yourself. You are motivated. You cant ask someone to be motivated about your "thing" unless you are paying them. Otherwise it should become a "we" thing.

Yes, either build it yourself, or successfully share your vision of how cool and successful this will be to a dev that makes it become a "we" thing.

This allows the dev to make small decisions several times a day that align with your vision. Meet and work together and iterate in real life as much as possible to keep bringing positive energy of how this thing is breaking new ground in this problem space.

I would personally stay away from production houses because I don't think I would be able to share my vision as direct and with the same weight, which would at least to some extent limit their motivation to make my project really stand out.

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#15

Post by danvoell »

It's a great question. I am in the exact same situation. The really difficult part of the equation is that every minute with your startup is time spent away from family. And as soon as you hit a snag developing (day 2) you begin to question if your time is best spent developing when you know someone else can do it in one tenth of the time. Feel free to drop me a line on gmail(danvoell). I am happy to commiserate with you or offer suggestions or help out.

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#16

Post by artharrison »

rficcaglia wrote: post #10

honestly if the idea isnt worth leaving the day job, and dedicating 6 months or so, maybe it is not the right idea? in any case, nothing is as important as the founder's investment of time amd focus in any new business. that said, i would also look for enthusiastic volunteers (equity based, deferred comp, experience, former employees hoping to see another success, etc) to help so that it forces you to articulate a pl…

1. I totally agree and am always ready to leave the day job. I guess what I'm looking at here is the optimal way to get to the quit-job state. I'm not the best developer, so quitting to take on that responsibility seems counter productive ... Leave a job that pays well, allows me some freedom to invest in others working towards my goal - just so that I can devote all my time to work that I'll never be the best at / other would do a better job of ... Part of the problem here is likely the fact that I should probably be in a "non-technical" cofounder role, but I just happen to have enough technical founder skills that prevent me from embracing that approach whole-heartedly.

I'm really trying to find the best balance of risk/reward here -- while accelerating the timeline as much as possible.

2. I'm at the dayjob - so, technicall my time on HN is helping finance the upcoming project... (note to those who work with/for me / are quite possibly reading this: -- this was a lunch break post & you all know I run a number of side projects -- don't get too scared that I'm leaving tomorrow...)

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#17

Post by idoh »

I have a lot of experience with outsourced development, my last couple projects have been like that and it has worked out really well (as in, profitable apps with a lot of users). So I know it's possible.

For concern about rights / stolen ideas, I don't think it should be a major problem. By and large they are interested in getting paid, if you are a good partner then things should be OK. There are things you can do to mitigate the risk, e.g. if it is an iOS app then you submit the app yourself and get the payments directly, make sure to get the source code, etc.

If you want to know more then let me know.

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#18

Post by carlosdaniel »

artharrison wrote: post #11
carlosdaniel wrote: post #7

Sounds like a case where you would usually push through by yourself, but given what happened last time I think you would be better getting some extra help and getting the product out sooner. I know a couple of outsourcing companies so I can give you a few pointers, good companies have NDAs and other contracts in place to protect you and your IP, usually they have US presence and they have workers on aligned timezones…

Would love that info - at least it would give me some concrete examples of what's available. I definitely have a budget -- willing to invest in the idea & no longer a starving student, so I certainly wouldn't want to be going the rock-bottom cheap route. Thanks.

I know of a company that works more like extending your engineering team, it's called Nearsoft, they have presence in the valley so if you live around I can drop you the contact info of one of the founders and help schedule a coffee meeting or something informal just to get to know how they work.

I recommend you them because they have several startups as their clients, some small other big so they could probably be a good fit.

I'll keep it there as this is starting to sound like an advert, so I'll leave my email: chadruva@hotmail.com

Cheers.

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#19

Post by vtanase »

sixQuarks wrote: post #12

I'm basically in the same situation. Here is the solution I found that is working for me. I'm assuming you have a clear vision for your product/service. You're going to have to take the lead on owning the product, there's no getting around this. There's almost no chance you're going to find a co-founder that's going to handle the product/development, etc while you focus on marketing. I've tried and each time has ende…

I will have to disagree on this, this advice is only good if your sole purpose is to make a quick buck. If you want to start a long term solid business than I suggest you treat people like humans and not like cheap interchangeable pieces as this post suggests.

Think of it this way, since you are not the one developing the application how much will you know about all its inner workings? When you will have customers and a critical bug in production who will solve it?

If you intend to outsource it I will suggest that you do not look for a cheap quick hack, but rather look for a freelancer with a decent rate, with whom you can build a working professional relationship. You want someone that will stick around for the long run and take responsibility for the software he develops, since building it is just the first step.

Re: Ask HN: Startup Quandary - build myself, hire or outsource

#20

Post by mhuang511 »

Did you ever think of skill exchange?

I am interest in your current role "Marketer". Recently I just launch my startup product(peoplelamp.com). Now I am headache on how to promote it on US market especially I am living in Asia(Taiwan). Take a look at my site and see if my skills fulfill your expectation. I build this site myself. If you are interesting we can discuss further.

Not sure if my response violate the posting rules of HN. If it did, I will remove it immediately.

Post reply on HN