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LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

nytimes.com

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Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#121

Post by jamesmiller5 »

grmarcil wrote: post #66
epsylon wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can certainly induce a sense of the profound but I'm not sure they actually produce profundity. What's the difference?

One of the classic effects of LSD (happens to many but by no means all users) is a sensation of ego death - ie, your sense of identity and who you are in the world is either eliminated or greatly changed. This, as you might imagine, is an extremely profound feeling ('a sense of the profound'). But, after coming down, does this experience have any grounding in reality? Did it 'actually produce profundity' or was it a…

This is a subjective example but... In the last 6 months I've been prescribed medical cannabis and after trying it for the first time in my life I was able to understand and analyze both film and music more in-depth.

For example, although I had seen the Xena: Warrior Princess musical episode "The Bitter Suite" before numerous times it wasn't until under the influence was I able to emotionally and mentally understand the allegory of the episode.

Basically, the symbolism of Gabrielle having a "demon" child forced into her against her will, who Xena considered a monster and wanted to kill whilst Gabrielle blamed herself for it's inception is a very clear metaphor of a rape. It took a strong emotional attachment to the journey of the main characters to truly appreciate as well as understand the message encoded in the symbolism. It may not be "profound" as the meaning of everything but realizing that with my own devices was at least enlightening.

In my very limited experience mind altering drugs seem to turn off/lessen the assumptions one makes, to step outside the critical path and analyze information more in-depth.

[Edit] Correcting auto-correct

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#122

Post by nanidin »

debt wrote: post #96
mentos wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My late aunt was schizophrenic and apparently became so after experimenting with LSD. I've always thought it was coincidence but I remain wary of the cost/benefit. Here's an interesting article on experimentation with LSD by mathematicians, engineers, designers and artists. 'In mid-'60s LSD research study, dosed scientists achieved creative breakthroughs: Over the course of the preceding year, IFAS researchers had do…

Told ya. :) Cool study. In all seriousness though LSD can have long-lasting effects on your personality. Also, while it seems possible you could develop a serious mental disorder from LSD, it seems unlikely; but I base that on my first-hand experience with it.

On the contrary, psychedelic drugs have been correlated with improved mental health in a recent study: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/809724

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#123

Post by nanidin »

phusion wrote: post #93
snake_plissken wrote: post #23

I've always found it incredibly amazing that psychedelics (LSD, psilocybin, MDMA, DMT etc) were outlawed in responses to forms of massive, peaceful "movements" in which taking psychedelics was something the members of the movement were known to do; that legislators and policy makers were so afraid of the affects these chemicals would have on society that they had to put the serious force of the law behind getting the…

Sorry to parrot hippies and/or Bill Hicks, but they outlawed those drugs because they're not alcohol and cigarettes, they allow you to see how you're being fucked every day of your life, so of course they're outlawed :)That peaceful movement was a threat to the powers that be..

Yes, it's definitely a conspiracy. Never forget the man is out to get us!

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#124

Post by shawnz »

Karunamon wrote: post #117
anewcolor wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

marijuana and writing code go together like song and lyric

It actually has the opposite effect for me.. Getting a little faded cranks up my usual ADD to the point where I can't do much of any productive work. The things I could do with better focus and less of a need to seek novelty....

> The things I could do with better focus and less of a need to seek novelty....

Isn't it a need to seek novelty that makes you want to do those things?

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#125

Post by bennyg »

h1karu wrote: post #94
grmarcil wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the classic effects of LSD (happens to many but by no means all users) is a sensation of ego death - ie, your sense of identity and who you are in the world is either eliminated or greatly changed. This, as you might imagine, is an extremely profound feeling ('a sense of the profound'). But, after coming down, does this experience have any grounding in reality? Did it 'actually produce profundity' or was it a…

"Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imagination of ourselves. Here's Tom with the weather." - Bill Hicks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7D0BeLz5blM

His stand ups are worth watching in their entirety too.

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#126

Post by bennyg »

sizzle wrote: post #73
grmarcil wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the classic effects of LSD (happens to many but by no means all users) is a sensation of ego death - ie, your sense of identity and who you are in the world is either eliminated or greatly changed. This, as you might imagine, is an extremely profound feeling ('a sense of the profound'). But, after coming down, does this experience have any grounding in reality? Did it 'actually produce profundity' or was it a…

I only heard about this phenomenon with shroom, good to know.

Both molecules are very similar and have been theorized to act very similarly in the way they affect neurotransmitters. However, as anyone who has experienced both will tell you, they are quantifiably and qualitatively different.

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#127

Post by bennyg »

hiphopyo wrote: post #18
EC1 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Before entering the corporate work place I never touched anything. Once my one coworker started talking about it, the whole chain revealed itself, now it's super social to go smoke a joint with my bosses after work and have a beer, I love it. I wonder how much I'm actually destroying my health by smoking weed every day, drinking coffee, and having some alcohol at least in a minor capacity. I feel as if the emotional/…

Everything excess in life is poison. Like they say, it is possible that you hate a thing which is good for you [emotional/mental pain], and love a thing which is bad for you [being a drunk].

Maybe. I'm not convinced that when things are going well we should try to make things go badly just to "feel the downswing too." I think it more has to do with the fact that life can have ups and downs, they aren't easily predictable, and one shouldn't be afraid to face them both in stride.

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#128

Post by lutusp »

mgr86 wrote: post #51
lutusp wrote: post #32

A quote: "After about two months of weekly therapy, the eight participants who received full doses of LSD improved by about 20 percent on standard measures of anxiety, and the four subjects who took a much weaker dose got worse." I hope no one thinks this is science. There's no control group, those who received the treatment under study knew who they were, and they were asked about their emotional state after the tre…

Yes, but if you continue reading the start of the very next paragraph addresses this. >The trial was far too small to be conclusive, >said Dr. Gasser, whose co-authors include Dr. Doblin, >Dominique Holstein of UniversityHospital Zurich and Rudolf >Brenneisen of the University of Bern. they go on to say that >“It’s a proof of concept,” Dr. Doblin said. >“It shows that this kind of trial can be done safely, and >that…

> Yes, but if you continue reading the start of the very next paragraph addresses this. "The trial was far too small to be conclusive ..."

Yes, and it's somewhat discouraging to see how rarely these appropriate caveats never get into either the headlines or the mind of the public.

>“It’s a proof of concept,” Dr. Doblin said. >“It shows that this kind of trial can be done safely, and >that it’s very much worth doing.”

That exactly what has not been demonstrated. A 20% change is not statistically significant in a test group of this size even if there had been a control group, and the placebo effect has not been controlled for. That's why I posted as I did -- it's junk science.

Again, LSD might be a breakthrough in therapy, unfortunately this study doesn't contribute to our scientific understanding.

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#129

Post by colanderman »

jamesmiller5 wrote: post #121
grmarcil wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the classic effects of LSD (happens to many but by no means all users) is a sensation of ego death - ie, your sense of identity and who you are in the world is either eliminated or greatly changed. This, as you might imagine, is an extremely profound feeling ('a sense of the profound'). But, after coming down, does this experience have any grounding in reality? Did it 'actually produce profundity' or was it a…

This is a subjective example but... In the last 6 months I've been prescribed medical cannabis and after trying it for the first time in my life I was able to understand and analyze both film and music more in-depth. For example, although I had seen the Xena: Warrior Princess musical episode "The Bitter Suite" before numerous times it wasn't until under the influence was I able to emotionally and mentally understand…

medical cannibals

Are those anything like medical leeches?

Re: LSD, Reconsidered for Therapy

#130

Post by ridgeguy »

conradfr wrote: post #37

My mother suffered from cluster headaches recently (the worst pain you can endure in life they say). Apparently mushrooms and LSD are unofficial treatments. When asked, her doctor encouraged her to use mushrooms ... Apparently a non-psychedelic version of LSD could be made but it's difficult to justify spending millions in research with the official stance regarding drugs. I'm glad change seems to come, albeit slowly…

Yes, there's a non-hallucinogenic derivative of LSD that might be an effective treatment for cluster headaches.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2-Bromo-LSD

My wife suffers from refractory migraine headaches - somewhat different from cluster headaches, but near neighbors on the chronic headache agony spectrum. I wish there were a clinical trial of 2-B-LSD she could join. Absent that, I'm building a TCDS system for her. Necessity & invention, etc.

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