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How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

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Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#12

This reminds me of Lockhart's Lament, which I highly recommend reading http://www.maa.org/sites/default/files/pdf/devlin/LockhartsL...

That was a fun read, but no one can teach that way. You can't become a teacher by studying math, physics, chemistry, biology, literature, french, programming, history, geography or english. You become a teacher in the US by getting a teaching degree. I believe that is the biggest problem we have in the US education system.

Teachers only need minimal knowledge of their subject, and if someone discovers that they don't actually like teaching then they just keep doing it anyway because they got a teaching degree, and can't do much else with it.

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#13
I'm very much a math person, but I think this author is being rather naive. In the current political climate surrounding education, it seems like madness to say, "Teach math more like we teach art!" After all, art classes in the US are pretty much first on the chopping block for the many, many people who think education should be all about test scores and checklists.

I would love to see more kids exposed to "real math" somehow. But there's a valid question of how to make sure they wind up with practical, applicable skills in the process, and I found the arguments here about "the value of abstract thinking" too vague to feel convincing (at least to folks who aren't already immersed in real math). I don't know the answers to those questions, but I certainly hope we can find them.

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#14

The biggest problem in education isn't the curriculum or method of teaching or the teachers, it's how motivated the student is (which is usually a product of their home environment). Trying to solve this social issue with "technical" fixes is not going to succeed.

Try motivating art students to paint fences. And never show them any "art" except different colored fences. That's what this article is about. If you teach real math, you can actually motivate people to want to learn it.

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#15
post #13

I'm very much a math person, but I think this author is being rather naive. In the current political climate surrounding education, it seems like madness to say, "Teach math more like we teach art!" After all, art classes in the US are pretty much first on the chopping block for the many, many people who think education should be all about test scores and checklists. I would love to see more kids exposed to "real mat…

The problem is that they already don't end up with practical applicable skills, and this method (teaching with an emphasis on discovery over lecture) is known to have results.

See, for example, this lengthy technical document describing (in more scientific terms) teaching math like art [1]

[1]: http://www.ams.org/notices/201308/rnoti-p1018.pdf

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#16

This reminds me of Lockhart's Lament, which I highly recommend reading http://www.maa.org/sites/default/files/pdf/devlin/LockhartsL...

That was a fun read, but no one can teach that way. You can't become a teacher by studying math, physics, chemistry, biology, literature, french, programming, history, geography or english. You become a teacher in the US by getting a teaching degree. I believe that is the biggest problem we have in the US education system. Teachers only need minimal knowledge of their subject, and if someone discovers that they don't…

Low standards for math teachers is a huge concern, and Lockhart addresses it too, I believe.

Some possible ways to help: give teachers less class time and more time to prepare interesting lessons, pay teachers more, raise the standards of training and hiring.

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#17
As a person who does some math, I disagree with this article. I agree with the author that mathematics is the language of abstraction, but do not think that school mathematics should put abstract before the concrete. One would think that the failure of "New Math" of the 1960s would have been enough:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wHDn8LDks8 [Tom Lehrer, "New Math"]

Just because something is abstract and more general does not necessarily imply that it is more insightful than concrete calculations. I feel that abstract mathematics should be confined to higher education. A good antidote to such articles are these by legendary mathematicians:

http://pauli.uni-muenster.de/~munsteg/arnold.html [V. I. Arnold]

http://ega-math.narod.ru/LSP/ch1.htm [L. S. Pontryagin]

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#18
Math is like knitting. It's not useful to read about it. You must do it.

When reading an advanced math book for the fist time, I can spend 1 hour per page, because I must copy the proof, try a few "improvements" that are dead ends, do some exercise, and understand what is the main idea of that part.

It's very difficult to mixing some modern subjects without calculation. Most of the time, the idea is to just hide the technical details so now it's totally unintelligible and the only possible way to learn it is by memorization. It's possible to teach magic and religion in the same way.

I like to add some comments about applications in my classes, but they are marked as off topic, and they are short because usually there is no time to spare.

Some of the proposed subjects are plausible to teach, for example module arithmetic. I'd like to see a discussion in school about the module 2, 9 and 10 arithmetic. (2 is almost intuitive, 10 is easy to see, and 9 is the base for the "rule of nines" test, that is usually teached without proof)

But, for example, Riemannian geometry is difficult. It's possible to pick a sphere surface and show that the geodesic intersects in two points. Explain the sum of the angles in a triangle? And then what? I don't have any intuition about hyperbolic geometry. It's difficult to students to see what is happening with the geometry in a plane in spite it's easy to draw, and we have paper everywhere to tray.

> I recently visited students in fourth, fifth and sixth grades at a school in New York to talk about the ideas of modern math, ideas they had never heard of before. [...] I used a Rubik's Cube to explain symmetry groups: Every rotation of the cube is a "symmetry," and these combine into what mathematicians call a group. I saw students' eyes light up when they realized that when they were solving the puzzle, they were simply discerning the structure of this group.

It's an interesting topic, but the problem is not how much you can explain but how much the students understand. Did he make any test to measure it? Can the students solve the Rubik's Cube?

I'd like to see a test for this idea. Pick 10 classes and divide them in two groups. Give 5 of them the traditional education and 5 of them the "modern topics" proposal. Pick the classes at random. Pick the teachers at random!!! Don't compare one class with a standard underpaid "traditional" teacher with 30 students and a class with a specially selected for the experiment teacher with 10 students. And compare them with multiple choice exercise, not teacher opinion or self report interest.

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#19
post #5

Focusing on the age is probably the wrong approach. Math true then is still true now. The problem is that the curriculum is now held sacred (and I mean that fully as nastily as possible), and it is being held there by people who are now the blind-leading-the-blind unto the sixth or seventh generation. I've gotten around in the math world a lot since primary school, and what I was taught vs. any actual modern mathemat…

The curriculum changed. For example, logarithm tables were a standard topic. I don't know haw many hours in a year were use to explain it. Now that subject luckily has disappeared because it's not necessary.

Note: There are some tables that are very similar, for example the voltage of a thermocouple.

Re: How our 1,000-year-old math curriculum cheats America's kids

#20
This is like learning art history instead of how to draw. How does the "majestic harmony of Platonic solids" help a middle schooler actually do some math? Why should the average sixth grade class learn about Riemann surfaces when most of them haven't even learned what an exponent is yet?

An occasional lecture on a 'fun' topic (or even better, an assigned reading and short essay -- expository writing should be practiced in every subject starting in middle school or earlier) could be motivational. But the author wants to spend "20% of class time opening students' eyes to the power and exquisite harmony of modern math," which he expects would "feed their natural curiosity, motivate them to study more and inspire them to engage math beyond the basic requirements." That's fantasy land. The author sounds like what he is, a UC Berkeley mathematics professor. If students are going to succeed in his college-level courses then they need the basics down cold, which means memorization, repetition, and application to concrete problems. That is, the "stale and boring" stuff.

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