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Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

business.time.com

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Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#61

Post by bluedino »

eropple wrote: post #50
bluedino wrote: post #43

How much of a typical student loan is tuition and books, and how much of it is room, board, computers, Starbucks and partying? I know tuition and books have skyrocketed but at the same time I know people who spent student loan money on flat screen televisions, computers, spring break trips, and used cars.

This is the "poor people have refrigerators" thinking writ large. Tuition and room and board can easily crack $100k at the schools that are social gatekeepers for the upper class (that people want to go to for that reason).

Time magazine piece on that exact topic -

http://healthland.time.com/2012/08/02/are-college-kids-blowi...

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#62

Post by will_work4tears »

SixSigma wrote: post #6
ck2 wrote: post #3

It blows my mind that it costs $400k to become a quality dentist in the USA these days. No wonder I see people train overseas and then just get a license here. How is health care ever going to be affordable in this country if the doctors and dentists have to carry so much debt?

It boggles the mind. By the time I graduate I will owe about 1 year's projected income (about $70k) and I think that's a pretty good return. If a dentist can make back nearly half a million then something needs to be done about the cost of dentristry, something doesn't add up.

Yeah, apparently the median salary of a dentist is ~145k with the highest earners making almost 190k and the lowest earners making ~75k.

More of a relative hit than a CS type for sure.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#63

Post by stefan_kendall »

yashg wrote: post #13
ck2 wrote: post #3

It blows my mind that it costs $400k to become a quality dentist in the USA these days. No wonder I see people train overseas and then just get a license here. How is health care ever going to be affordable in this country if the doctors and dentists have to carry so much debt?

Exactly my thought when I read that. $400,000 for dentist? Heck some people don't even give them as much respect as they give to other kind of doctors. Some say they aren't even doctors. No wonder people go to India or Eastern Europe to get their teeth replaced.

$400,000 is on the extreme high end of dentistry school. Moving and attending a school for half the cost makes much, much, much more sense.

But people are stupid and don't like to move.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#64

Post by bluedino »

raverbashing wrote: post #52
enraged_camel wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow. I like you blamed this entire mess on students and parents. >>The real issue is that people feel entitled to the best schools and will so make absurd decisions to enable it Nonsense. People want to send their kids to the best schools because the best schools are the gatekeepers to the upper class. Someone who graduates from an Ivy League school gets to build a network with affluent alumni and has a high chance o…

"Someone who graduates from an Ivy League school gets to build a network with affluent alumni and has a high chance of landing a job that pays six-figures right off the bat" Absolutely not the case So if I graduate anything from an Ivy League I'm getting a 6 figure job? No. Especially when fresh out of the school. This is an idealization of schools in detriment of personal effort. After some years of experience SCHOO…

Tell that to the local company who has a policy of not hiring engineers from the state school that's just a few minutes away.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#65

Post by stefan_kendall »

aaron-lebo wrote: post #27
higherpurpose wrote: post #7

So stop letting the government guarantee the loans. Watch how the prices fall once only a small fraction can afford to take a $200,000 loan to pay for their college, afterwards. US colleges have been spoiled. That's why prices are so high.

How do you balance that with giving access to college to individuals who wouldn't have it otherwise? It isn't black and white.

An art history degree is worthless to most people, especially those who need the help in the first place.

What would happen is that lenders would only lend to degrees and individuals for which they could get an ROI - degrees that actually pay for individuals likely to follow through.

Going to college doesn't help you if you wind up working at starbucks. All education is not equal.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#66

Post by raverbashing »

bluedino wrote: post #64
raverbashing wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Someone who graduates from an Ivy League school gets to build a network with affluent alumni and has a high chance of landing a job that pays six-figures right off the bat" Absolutely not the case So if I graduate anything from an Ivy League I'm getting a 6 figure job? No. Especially when fresh out of the school. This is an idealization of schools in detriment of personal effort. After some years of experience SCHOO…

Tell that to the local company who has a policy of not hiring engineers from the state school that's just a few minutes away.

So, they can't work at that company, and?

Are they the only employers? Also, if you have to go to school X (outside of the state) and then come back, well, there are better choices, no?

There are always places that won't hire you because of your school, that's usually a red flag.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#67

Post by dlp211 »

dredmorbius wrote: post #59
dlp211 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the only reason that costs are increasing and to imply that it is, is dishonest.

Curious, but what other reasons do you see?

I go to a research university so there are 4 main sources of funding in no particular order:

1) State funding (public tax dollars)

2) Student tuition

3) Research Grants

4) Alumni donations

State funding is down, research grants are down, and alumni donations are down. The autonomous costs of a university don't decline, so that loss in revenue needs to be made up elsewhere, thus it comes from student tuition.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#68

Post by j2kun »

patmcguire wrote: post #21

It's not the interest, it's the principal. And I don't understand how the principal got so high. Is calculus ten times more expensive to teach than it was thirty years ago? Is Shakespeare? Supply is totally inelastic, because it's almost impossible to get a new college accredited (for profit schools all started with an already accredited school and expand them). Same with demand - not having a college degree puts you…

> and maybe a little research

Understatement of the year. At my institution administrator hiring has been on the rise for the last ten years and funding for professors and new hires has been declining. Our institution also has a huge surplus of unallocated funds (literally just sitting around) that they refuse to devote to education or research.

The principal got so high because higher education has turned into a market, and the people they hire to run schools are business people. All they care about are profits.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#69

Post by enraged_camel »

raverbashing wrote: post #66
bluedino wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell that to the local company who has a policy of not hiring engineers from the state school that's just a few minutes away.

So, they can't work at that company, and? Are they the only employers? Also, if you have to go to school X (outside of the state) and then come back, well, there are better choices, no? There are always places that won't hire you because of your school, that's usually a red flag.

>>There are always places that won't hire you because of your school, that's usually a red flag.

The point is that there are many more places who will hire you simply because you have an Ivy League degree than there are places who won't even consider you because you are Ivy League. Whereas the exact opposite is true for local schools and community colleges.

Heck, forget the USA. Having a degree from a place like Harvard will pretty much guarantee you at least an interview anywhere in the world.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#70

Post by j2kun »

joezydeco wrote: post #56

This is an interesting NPR Planet Money podcast where they try to break down why Duke's tuition costs $60,000/yr (and Duke claims that the actual cost of a student is really $90,000/yr). http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2014/02/26/283018555/episode-... One of the most interesting points is that colleges are in a unique inverted position when it comes to price vs. demand. Cutting their tuition price would actually decre…

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