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Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

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Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#21

Post by akmiller »

thras wrote: post #17
euroclydon wrote: post #4

Good stuff, but it's still that (Western?) way of thinking about treating the symptom.

The above poster has a valid point. He thinks that rather than making millions of single-purpose plastic bags and then going through an expensive process to clean up after them, we should instead not produce the plastic bags in the first place. For example, we could just keep canvas bags in our cars. That the parent has been moderated down so much is troubling.

I agree, but you made his point much better than he did and without the insult. I think the point is to be more conscious of what we consume. However, plastic is not going away anytime soon so we should instead encourage people (not mandate!) to attempt to consume less of these materials and at the same time keep innovating on finding replacement materials as well as ways to properly dispose.

Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#22

Post by euroclydon »

edw519 wrote: post #19
thras wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The above poster has a valid point. He thinks that rather than making millions of single-purpose plastic bags and then going through an expensive process to clean up after them, we should instead not produce the plastic bags in the first place. For example, we could just keep canvas bags in our cars. That the parent has been moderated down so much is troubling.

"That the parent has been moderated down so much is troubling." It's only troubling until you understand why. No one would reasonably argue against the idea of producing something other than plastic in the first place. The downmodding was most likely in response to the word "Western". Bash the U.S. (or anyone else, for that matter) and get downmodded. What's so troubling about that? You can make a logical point on hn…

Well, I questioned whether it's a Western phenomenon. I'm not trying to bash the U.S. I like being a citizen. I was actually trying to make an analogy to diet, health and medicine, where Western lifestyles have traditionally been found to be inferior to Eastern ones, because we, on average, eat crappy food, get diseases, then spend a bunch of money trying to fix the symptoms of those diseases.

Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#24

Post by warfangle »

Alex3917 wrote: post #20

If you have all plastic of the same kind, it's much better to recycle it. If you have garbage of all different kinds, this technique is useless. Everyone with basic scientific literacy already knows you can do this. But it doesn't solve any problem, let alone "the most intractable problem of our time" or whatever. This whole article is just linkbait written by interns to scam more ad impressions off of dumb people. W…

A lot of plastic recycling isn't recycling - it's downcycling. Plastic bottles become carpet becomes landfill fodder. It just delays the inevitable.

A lot of this has to do with the dyes used in plastics manufacturing. It also has to do with the limited mutability of most plastics - the quality of the plastic after one cycle of recycling (in this example, plastic bottle -> carpet) is reduced. Once it's turned to carpet, it becomes difficult to recycle this again due not only to this reduction in quality, but also because it becomes difficult to remove the plastic carpet material from the carpet backing. Attempting to recycle it again would result in a further inferior product - and it would be much more expensive (diminishing returns).

I'll say it again: Recycling as we know it is downcycling. It's good, in that it reuses the raw materials - but only for so many cycles. Eventually it ends up in the landfill.

The only true solution would be to manufacture consumables as if they're in a closed ecosystem - either able to easily be reused, or easily put into the natural ecosystem. Read "Cradle to Cradle" by William McDonough for more information (the book itself is printed on special infinitely recyclable plastic paper; the ink can be removed by boiling the book).

Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#26

Post by TrevorJ »

onreact-com wrote: post #10
jsonscripter wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love plastic :( I'd vastly prefer to recycle or decompose it than to never use it again.

Remember plastic is made of oil (petroleum) so people actually die for plastic.

Historically people die over anything desirable. Food, land, water, gold. There's no solution other than fixing human nature itself.

Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#27

Post by tobych »

thras wrote: post #17
euroclydon wrote: post #4

Good stuff, but it's still that (Western?) way of thinking about treating the symptom.

The above poster has a valid point. He thinks that rather than making millions of single-purpose plastic bags and then going through an expensive process to clean up after them, we should instead not produce the plastic bags in the first place. For example, we could just keep canvas bags in our cars. That the parent has been moderated down so much is troubling.

"we could just keep canvas bags in our cars."

Or on our bicycles, indeed. Or our trouser pockets as we walk down to the local corner-shop.

Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#28

Post by adharmad »

wrinklz wrote: post #18

"this young man who may have managed to solve one of the most intractable environmental dilemmas of our time" Solved? He demonstrated a proof of concept. But this was not news. Was the product of decomposition environmentally safe? Is the process economically feasible? Does it scale? All three questions need to be yes before we can say he solved the problem. Having said that, I am not knocking the kid or his school p…

You are right........but still a commendable achievement for a 16 year old!

Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#29

Post by TrevorJ »

warfangle wrote: post #24
Alex3917 wrote: post #20

If you have all plastic of the same kind, it's much better to recycle it. If you have garbage of all different kinds, this technique is useless. Everyone with basic scientific literacy already knows you can do this. But it doesn't solve any problem, let alone "the most intractable problem of our time" or whatever. This whole article is just linkbait written by interns to scam more ad impressions off of dumb people. W…

A lot of plastic recycling isn't recycling - it's downcycling. Plastic bottles become carpet becomes landfill fodder. It just delays the inevitable. A lot of this has to do with the dyes used in plastics manufacturing. It also has to do with the limited mutability of most plastics - the quality of the plastic after one cycle of recycling (in this example, plastic bottle -> carpet) is reduced. Once it's turned to carp…

It still depends on what the plastic decomposes into in the landfill. If this kid has helped solve that problem then it is still a step forward.

Re: Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag In 3 Months

#30

Post by briancooley »

liquidben wrote: post #23

Am I wrong in expecting that there should be something more than carbon dioxide and water? I would be the first to admit I know nothing of the molecular composition of the things involved, but shouldn't there be nitrogen leftover somewhere?

Grocery bags are made from polyethylene, which is composed only of carbon and hydrogen. Decomposition would not necessarily involve nitrogen. I can't speak to the byproducts of the bacteria.
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