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Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

business.time.com

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Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#21

Post by patmcguire »

It's not the interest, it's the principal. And I don't understand how the principal got so high.

Is calculus ten times more expensive to teach than it was thirty years ago? Is Shakespeare? Supply is totally inelastic, because it's almost impossible to get a new college accredited (for profit schools all started with an already accredited school and expand them). Same with demand - not having a college degree puts you on a lower track that's almost impossible to break out of, and the connections, etc. mean that MOOC's aren't a good substitute for undergraduate education, while the professions all require specialized schooling afterwards.

So where does all the money go? At a non profit university it goes to faceless, non-teaching administrators to play the school prestige game, and maybe a little research.

A generation is broke because they're not paying for education, they're paying for education that can't be unbundled from empire-building.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#22

Post by ck2 »

SixSigma wrote: post #6
ck2 wrote: post #3

It blows my mind that it costs $400k to become a quality dentist in the USA these days. No wonder I see people train overseas and then just get a license here. How is health care ever going to be affordable in this country if the doctors and dentists have to carry so much debt?

It boggles the mind. By the time I graduate I will owe about 1 year's projected income (about $70k) and I think that's a pretty good return. If a dentist can make back nearly half a million then something needs to be done about the cost of dentristry, something doesn't add up.

I think that is the point, they cannot easily make back the $400k

I have to go to the dental college because I do not have insurance, it is impossible to go to a dentist without insurance these days. I usually am seated among many other people at the college who actually have insurance, it is just their deductible is far too high unless they go to the dental school for work.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#23

Post by aaron-lebo »

Glyptodon wrote: post #18

Meh. This is (mostly) the students' and the families' who abet their stupid decisions fault. If you go to an in-state community college and then matriculate to an in-state university in my state the total cost of college is (~$4500 for 2 years of CC living at home + ~$25000 for 2 years of closest to home in-state school) ~$30000 + the cost of living at home. Meanwhile people continue to whine about sending their kids…

You are absolutely right about the relative value of community college, but you pointed out the major problem: community colleges are not thought of highly at all, even though 2 years of CC credited to a bachelor's degree at a more prestigious university counts just the same.

I'm not sure how CC's get over the stigma attached to them, but it really needs to happen. They are good value.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#24

Post by ck2 »

sjg007 wrote: post #15
ck2 wrote: post #3

It blows my mind that it costs $400k to become a quality dentist in the USA these days. No wonder I see people train overseas and then just get a license here. How is health care ever going to be affordable in this country if the doctors and dentists have to carry so much debt?

Americans could do the same, go abroad, get a degree and come back.

So basically outsource college. We're not going to have anything left.

Heck why even send people for education, why not go overseas for dental work (I bet it already happens).

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#25

Post by enraged_camel »

Glyptodon wrote: post #18

Meh. This is (mostly) the students' and the families' who abet their stupid decisions fault. If you go to an in-state community college and then matriculate to an in-state university in my state the total cost of college is (~$4500 for 2 years of CC living at home + ~$25000 for 2 years of closest to home in-state school) ~$30000 + the cost of living at home. Meanwhile people continue to whine about sending their kids…

Wow. I like you blamed this entire mess on students and parents.

>>The real issue is that people feel entitled to the best schools and will so make absurd decisions to enable it

Nonsense. People want to send their kids to the best schools because the best schools are the gatekeepers to the upper class. Someone who graduates from an Ivy League school gets to build a network with affluent alumni and has a high chance of landing a job that pays six-figures right off the bat. Someone who goes to a merely good state school though? There is a very good chance they won't even find a job after graduation.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#26

Post by superJoy »

aaron-lebo wrote: post #19
superJoy wrote: post #10

At what point do these students realize the cost indicates they should stay from that school? Like, "Oh wait, even though X is a better school than Y, it will cost 5x more, and my starting salary will only be 5% less." Is that happening? It just seems some of these people are naive. Another example is ones that are unaware of the economy of the city they aspire to live in, and get a degree with little value in that c…

How many 18 years olds are making rational decisions about return on investment in 10-15 years time? I'm not sure how you go about adequately informing students about a major life decision they are making.

My high school counselors frequently came by classes and spoke about college---while they didn't talk about the financials in detail, they easily could have. It'd be as simple as doing a quick calculation on the board of how long it will take to pay off some amount of debt. Now whether that advice would stick in the students' heads, I don't know, but they should at least try. There's also high school economics classes that should be discussing this. I was required to take one and my teacher actually did a better job of explaining the cost of college than the counselors.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#27

Post by aaron-lebo »

higherpurpose wrote: post #7

So stop letting the government guarantee the loans. Watch how the prices fall once only a small fraction can afford to take a $200,000 loan to pay for their college, afterwards. US colleges have been spoiled. That's why prices are so high.

How do you balance that with giving access to college to individuals who wouldn't have it otherwise?

It isn't black and white.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#28

Post by ck2 »

qwerta wrote: post #14

I have question how young students can give legal consent for such loan? Most teenagers can not legally drink or have a sex, but they can agree to this sort of commitment?

I believe most freshmen in US college are 18.

Cannot drink but everything else is legal.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#29

Post by aaron-lebo »

enraged_camel wrote: post #25
Glyptodon wrote: post #18

Meh. This is (mostly) the students' and the families' who abet their stupid decisions fault. If you go to an in-state community college and then matriculate to an in-state university in my state the total cost of college is (~$4500 for 2 years of CC living at home + ~$25000 for 2 years of closest to home in-state school) ~$30000 + the cost of living at home. Meanwhile people continue to whine about sending their kids…

Wow. I like you blamed this entire mess on students and parents. >>The real issue is that people feel entitled to the best schools and will so make absurd decisions to enable it Nonsense. People want to send their kids to the best schools because the best schools are the gatekeepers to the upper class. Someone who graduates from an Ivy League school gets to build a network with affluent alumni and has a high chance o…

> Someone who goes to a merely good state school though? There is a very good chance they won't even find a job after graduation.

You can't underestimate the psychological value people put on attending even just good colleges in your state, even when doing so isn't financially sound.

Re: Student Loans Are A Drag On The Economy

#30

Post by enraged_camel »

ck2 wrote: post #24
sjg007 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans could do the same, go abroad, get a degree and come back.

So basically outsource college. We're not going to have anything left. Heck why even send people for education, why not go overseas for dental work (I bet it already happens).

Absolutely. Health tourism is a very real thing.

Heck, I was born overseas and go back to visit twice a year. That's when I get my health-related stuff done. Not only is it ridiculously cheap (sometimes even fully covered by my parent's insurance, even though I'm almost 30), but it's also very high quality.

Healthcare in the US is an absolute joke. It makes me sad.

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