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Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

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Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#51

Post by arethuza »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #45
vrikis wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly that, plus Scots going to study in England had to pay their fees. As a side note though, if Scotland becomes independent when voted later on this year, then "Thousands of English, Welsh and Northern Irish students will study at Scottish universities for free" [1] [1] http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/universityeducation/102...

if Scotland becomes independent ... "... English, Welsh and Northern Irish students will study at Scottish universities for free..." This assumes that an independent Scotland would be a member of the EU, which is far from certain: http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/impossible...

If Scotland leaves the UK then there isn't a UK anymore - so why would England, Wales and NI still be in the EU? :-)

i.e. If a country splits into two parts surely you have two new countries.

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#52

Post by graeham »

I'm doing a PhD in the UK, and there certainly are people who are doing a PhD without funding (and paying quite high tuition, outside the EU is nearly £20k/yr), although they are a minority. I would guess 10%, less in STEM subjects. I started my program with only about half my funding in place while making plans to have secondary income to help fund my studies. Fortunately I was able to find the funding for the remaining part of my program, but it seems that most who try to find funding once starting their studies aren't successful in finding it (at least in the UK).

Acceptance to the program is quite a bit easier than getting funding. I wouldn't recommend studying without funding - in addition to the expense I have seen these students are often treated as second class.

In Canada, most people were funded in research assistantships coming from their PI, or had independent scholarships. This covered tuition and about $10,000 salary for research-based Masters or $15,000 for PhD, and could be supplemented by about $5000/year by teaching. This is marginally enough to live on without loans if you were thrifty and don't have dependents. I didn't know of anyone who wasn't paid (in Engineering - I think there were in Arts).

Its worth noting especially for STEM people that the biggest cost is probably opportunity cost compared to the salary (or start up) you could be doing instead of a PhD.

TL;DR - not paying tuition for a PhD isn't newsworthy.

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#53

Post by jebus989 »

n0mad_0 wrote: post #46
jebus989 wrote: post #35

Undergrad for free == interesting and not all that common (though does happen elsewhere in EU, e.g. Austria) PhD for free != interesting, I'm paid a tax-free stipend (UK) which also covers tuition fees (same for MSc). There are "self-funded" positions advertised but it's generally junior faculty trying their luck for overseas students. I've never heard of anyone actually paying out of their own pocket for PhD study i…

> I've never heard of anyone actually paying out of their own pocket for PhD study in the EU. That probably also indicates that phd is only for those who managed to find funding. Is it hard to secure funding for studies in the UK for the UK or EU nationals?

I agree. Honestly I'd say no (off-hand), obviously high-tier institutions are competitive but PhDs are cheap labour for senior academics and cheap to fund from a research council perspective.

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#54

Post by vrikis »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #45
vrikis wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly that, plus Scots going to study in England had to pay their fees. As a side note though, if Scotland becomes independent when voted later on this year, then "Thousands of English, Welsh and Northern Irish students will study at Scottish universities for free" [1] [1] http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/universityeducation/102...

if Scotland becomes independent ... "... English, Welsh and Northern Irish students will study at Scottish universities for free..." This assumes that an independent Scotland would be a member of the EU, which is far from certain: http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/impossible...

> “So it is to some extent a similar case because it’s a new country and so I believe it’s going to be extremely difficult, if not impossible, a new member state coming out of one of our countries getting the agreement of the others.”

See this is where everything just gets confusing... Scotland already IS a country by itself, as is England, NI, and Wales, so if Scotland were to become independent, it would in no way be a "new" country, would it? mhhhh, my head hurts.

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#55

Post by olssonm »

It used to be the same way in Sweden, all educations were free even for all foreigners. The hope was that once the foreigners took their exam they would stay in the country.

However, it didn't pan out too well – now foreigners from non-EU countries have to pay around (varies somewhat at the different universities) 9000USD per semester.

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#56

Post by letzjuc »

p4bl0 wrote: post #42
kaeluka wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a PhD student in Sweden. I'm expected to work 20% of my time for the University (teaching duties, conference organisation, mentoring new phd students). I'm getting payed a little bit lower than what the industry would pay. It's possible that salaries in the industry would also raise quicker. My PhD is supposed to take 4 years of research, but add in the 20% and you have 5 years. I have very high job security and…

> I'm getting payed a little bit lower than what the industry would pay. You mean for a "normal" (if I may) industry job or for doing a PhD within the industry? Because before starting my PhD, the salaries that I've been proposed by recruiters from various companies were more like the double (and sometimes more, like with Google or high frequency trading firms) of what I'm making as a PhD student (but for a way less…

In Germany I get paid around 3.500 Euro brutto per Month for pursuing my PhD at my university. Same conditions as the parent post: expected duration 5 years, 20% work time dedicated to university,...

That's around ~44.000 Euros per year (including perks).

I interviewed in 4 companies before deciding to go for the PhD (all engineering jobs). The salaries varied from 45.000 to 55.000 Euros brutto per year, with one offer at 60.000 Euros.

Friends working in industry make around 50.000 Euros which matches with my experience. Making a bit less for working in _your_ PhD is a really good deal here. If you find the right PhD for you it can be very gratifying (plus you are working for yourself). OTOH my friends in industry work way less hours than I do, so if I had a family I would probably had never gone the PhD way.

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#57

Post by nmc »

p4bl0 wrote: post #49
nmc wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are "fairly sure" but very wrong . Let us clarify (all of the following is about French PhD programmes). 1. The criteria for selecting a student for a PhD are publicly established by each doctoral school. They do not require any justification of income/wealth. 2. PhD students are not required to sign any contract or to be paid any salary . 2.1. Some of them have a "doctoral contract" (a new thing created in 2009…

Okay. In my doctoral school and the 3 or 4 other that I know of (because friends are there) it's not possible to register as a PhD student without an income justification (you of course don't need to provide it if you are paid by state or one of the universities/school to which the doctoral school is attached). I wasn't entirely sure if it was just a coincidence or if it was the law. Thanks for clarifying this. BTW,…

Hi back, and thank you for sharing your personal story. This confirms that some doctoral school directors actually enforce this verification of financial situation.

De Normalien à Normalien, bravo pour Ulm, moi j'étais même pas admissible ;-)

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#58

Post by rahimnathwani »

vrikis wrote: post #54
rahimnathwani wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if Scotland becomes independent ... "... English, Welsh and Northern Irish students will study at Scottish universities for free..." This assumes that an independent Scotland would be a member of the EU, which is far from certain: http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/impossible...

> “So it is to some extent a similar case because it’s a new country and so I believe it’s going to be extremely difficult, if not impossible, a new member state coming out of one of our countries getting the agreement of the others.” See this is where everything just gets confusing... Scotland already IS a country by itself, as is England, NI, and Wales, so if Scotland were to become independent, it would in no way…

Is Scotland really a country, in the sense that we usually understand the word?

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#59

Post by p4bl0 »

nmc wrote: post #57
p4bl0 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay. In my doctoral school and the 3 or 4 other that I know of (because friends are there) it's not possible to register as a PhD student without an income justification (you of course don't need to provide it if you are paid by state or one of the universities/school to which the doctoral school is attached). I wasn't entirely sure if it was just a coincidence or if it was the law. Thanks for clarifying this. BTW,…

Hi back, and thank you for sharing your personal story. This confirms that some doctoral school directors actually enforce this verification of financial situation. De Normalien à Normalien, bravo pour Ulm, moi j'étais même pas admissible ;-)

The director of my doctoral school is Christian Queinnec, of Lisp fame, and yes, he really is a great person.

Sinon, j'ai pas passé le concours :-p, j'étais étudiant au département informatique là bas, entré sur dossier après deux ans de fac d'informatique à Marseille. Anyway en informatique Cachan ou à Ulm à part la première année on fait vraiment la même chose :-).

Re: Getting a PhD in Norway is nearly free--even if you're not a citizen

#60

Post by vrikis »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #58
vrikis wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “So it is to some extent a similar case because it’s a new country and so I believe it’s going to be extremely difficult, if not impossible, a new member state coming out of one of our countries getting the agreement of the others.” See this is where everything just gets confusing... Scotland already IS a country by itself, as is England, NI, and Wales, so if Scotland were to become independent, it would in no way…

Is Scotland really a country, in the sense that we usually understand the word?

It's difficult to answer, but I'd say yes. It doesn't in the sense that Scotland (nor does England, NI, Wales) have its own embassy in other countries, etc. All members of the United Kingdom are tightly integrated (e.g. Scotland doesn't issue money, but privately held banks-e.g. Bank of Scotland-do print money on behalf of central government) so it's really difficult to say but for the most part, it's more of its own country than now, I'd say.
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