Why I stopped being a voluntourist • Hacker News Board

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#41

Post by BrainInAJar » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:24 AM UTC

DateK wrote: post #33

_ll5a wrote: post #16

If you really want to help people, find a charity to donate to via Givewell. It won't feel as warm and fuzzy as volunteering, but in most cases that's the best way you can actually help people in need.

I'm using kiva.org and have deposited $9,000 over couple of years. With auto-relend option my account circulated currently $58,325 through 2,268 loans (individuals or groups) in 61 countries. http://www.kiva.org/lender/kizaemon For auto-relend I chose all countries except US, both genders. The sectors are Agriculture, Clothing, Education, Food, Health, Manufacturing, Retail. Have not chosen sectors Arts, Construction…

FYI, kiva is a scam (in as much as the company is incompetent) that primarily props up predatory lenders in other countries

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#42

Post by gaius » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:26 AM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #21

I have seen, heard of and have been invited to participate in these trips. Some are NGOs, some are religious groups. Yeah, looking at it from the perspective she wrote, it seems ridiculous. It is an "industry", wrapped in a non-profit, save-the-world PR shroud, that caters to educated, Westerners who can afford to travel overseas. People feel good when they do good. Whether they other side perceives it as good, somet…

"Raising awareness" is such bullshit. It's a lie people tell themselves so they can feel good sitting in an air conditioned office earning a good wage running a "social media campaign" and never getting their hands dirty or having to meet any of the people they're "helping".

http://metro.co.uk/2010/09/21/bono-under-fire-over-one-chari...

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#43

Post by kumarski » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:27 AM UTC

The absolute worst thing is when the voluntourists don't speak the native language and stick out visually like a black man in Sweden.

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#44

Post by kumarski » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:28 AM UTC

The number one way to help people in the 3rd world is find hungry competent entrepreneurs in the country and ask them about their problems.

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#45

Post by colechristensen » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:34 AM UTC

BrainInAJar wrote: post #41

DateK wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm using kiva.org and have deposited $9,000 over couple of years. With auto-relend option my account circulated currently $58,325 through 2,268 loans (individuals or groups) in 61 countries. http://www.kiva.org/lender/kizaemon For auto-relend I chose all countries except US, both genders. The sectors are Agriculture, Clothing, Education, Food, Health, Manufacturing, Retail. Have not chosen sectors Arts, Construction…

FYI, kiva is a scam (in as much as the company is incompetent) that primarily props up predatory lenders in other countries

Evidence: Just look at the portfolio yield of many of kiva's lenders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiva_(organization)#Current_int...

If you're making more than a percent or two interest in what you believe is warm-fuzzy charitable lending, you're simply deluded. Almost all of these enjoy double digit interest rate yields... that's after losses for defaults. Most are around 30% some over 80%. It is very obviously a morally bankrupt practice which has managed to clothe itself as a charity.

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#46

Post by count » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:37 AM UTC

herbig wrote: post #14

Most Peace Corps type voluntourism works on the premise that throwing "white" folks into a country and telling them to fix things will generate results. This is because, you know, we understand the incredibly complex social, economic, political, and cultural dynamics of countries better than they know themselves. We're better educated, and if these backwards countries would just start doing XYZ they'd start to lift t…

Heh, right, because those locations the Peace Corp sends folks are doing so damn well by themselves!

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#47

Post by tempestn » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:38 AM UTC

BrainInAJar wrote: post #41

DateK wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm using kiva.org and have deposited $9,000 over couple of years. With auto-relend option my account circulated currently $58,325 through 2,268 loans (individuals or groups) in 61 countries. http://www.kiva.org/lender/kizaemon For auto-relend I chose all countries except US, both genders. The sectors are Agriculture, Clothing, Education, Food, Health, Manufacturing, Retail. Have not chosen sectors Arts, Construction…

FYI, kiva is a scam (in as much as the company is incompetent) that primarily props up predatory lenders in other countries

I'm not disagreeing with you, and recall reading elsewhere about Kiva's deceptive practices, but could you back up that claim with some evidence, or at least a more detailed explanation?

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#48

Post by saraid216 » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:38 AM UTC

winfred wrote: post #22

saraid216 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I asked how she got that gig, and she told me a story about her going to Tanzania to build a school. She decided to make a real difference. When you (or she) don't explain how she got from A to B, your epiphany has a lot less force. Most kids that come back from these trips seem to have no idea that they weren't helping. How did she realize it? How did she do something about it? How did she start actually doing som…

Use your imagination? Someone wants to help, goes to A, someone else there will be paying attention to how that person is behaving, how effective or ineffective etc. Call it simply human behavior or scouting or what not. For most of the visitors that's it, they'll be thanked at the end and feel good, but some might get a call or an email at some point to ask of they want to be more involved with B.

So basically, you're saying that these trips are tech company interviews?

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#49

Post by auctiontheory » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:39 AM UTC

jcampbell1 wrote: post #10

I took a trip to Africa to go on a Safari and climb Kilimanjaro. I was amazed at how many do gooder tourists there are. The conversations go like: Me: What are you here to do? Them: Build a school. Me: Oh, you are a carpenter. Them: No, part of a school program. Me: Oh, you are providing unskilled construction labor. Didn't realize Tanzania had a shortage. Near the end of the trip, I met a friend's cousin, asked what…

I am certainly less snarky about kids going to do unskilled construction labor.

Most middle-class Americans could find a neighborhood within 15-minutes drive that could really use their help. But "my adventures in East Palo Alto" just isn't as exciting on a law school application, or a date, as "tales of Eritrea."

Re: Why I stopped being a voluntourist

#50

Post by auctiontheory » Wed, Feb 26, 2014, 6:41 AM UTC

DateK wrote: post #33

_ll5a wrote: post #16

If you really want to help people, find a charity to donate to via Givewell. It won't feel as warm and fuzzy as volunteering, but in most cases that's the best way you can actually help people in need.

I'm using kiva.org and have deposited $9,000 over couple of years. With auto-relend option my account circulated currently $58,325 through 2,268 loans (individuals or groups) in 61 countries. http://www.kiva.org/lender/kizaemon For auto-relend I chose all countries except US, both genders. The sectors are Agriculture, Clothing, Education, Food, Health, Manufacturing, Retail. Have not chosen sectors Arts, Construction…

I used to donate through Kiva until I discovered that the whole "directing" story was just marketing. That doesn't make Kiva evil, but it does remove much of the feel-good motivation of supporting a named project.