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Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

arstechnica.com

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Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#21

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

Here's the thing

You replace a "dumb heat generator" with a dogcoin miner.

That is: turn down the heating in your place and let the computer heat it up a bit.

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#22
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but in a large building / campus, they can't possibly monitor electricity usage per individual or company occupying the space without upgrading the infrastructure significantly.

I'm imagining a future where every 'public' power outlet has a credit card reader attached.

You mean a bitcoin interface, surely :-)

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#23

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1xgd8v/those_words_...

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#24

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

Here's the thing You replace a "dumb heat generator" with a dogcoin miner. That is: turn down the heating in your place and let the computer heat it up a bit.

Heh, that works in the winter but not in North American summers.

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#25

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

Here's the thing You replace a "dumb heat generator" with a dogcoin miner. That is: turn down the heating in your place and let the computer heat it up a bit.

While a dogecoin miner is almost exactly as efficient an electrical heater as a standard resistive electrical heater, they are both less efficient than heat pumps (or in specific cases, such as heating a single person without having to first heat a very large and cold room, they are both less efficient than radiative electric heaters).

And of course electric heating is typically more expensive than natural gas, fuel oil, coal, municipal steam, etc... If you are turning down the natural gas and turning up the electric heaters, you are burning through money.

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#26

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

Here's the thing You replace a "dumb heat generator" with a dogcoin miner. That is: turn down the heating in your place and let the computer heat it up a bit.

The problem isn't individual rigs in private dwellings; it's that entire data centers are being built purely to mine crypto currencies. At that scale heat dissipation itself becomes an energy expending task.

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#27

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

Define non-negligible and show us some numbers. Mining is supposed to be difficult.

Here's a back of the envelope calculation. In theory (by supply-demand idea), you would make a negligible profit mining bitcoins. Each bitcoin is worth about $600. If our supply-demand assumption is true, the $2,160,000 dollars of Bitcoins that come into existence every day, that's also about $2,160,000 of electricity used. Or about 18,000,000 kWh per day. Or about 9,000,000 kg of C02 per day (9000 metric tonnes). That's about 3,285 thousand metric tonnes per year, or about the entire annual CO2 output of a country such as Papua New Guinea.

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#29

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

From the README of my "Cuckoo Cycle" Proof-of-Work at https://github.com/tromp/cuckoo :

Mining is generally considered to be inherently power hungry but it need not be. It’s a consequence of making the proof of work computationally intensive. If computation is minimized in favor of random access to gigabytes of memory (incurring long latencies), then mining will require large investments in RAM but relatively little power.

Cuckoo Cycle represents a breakthrough in three important ways:

1) it performs only one very cheap siphash computation for about 3.3 random accesses to memory,

2) its memory requirement can be set arbitrarily and doesn't allow for any time-memory trade-off.

3) verification of the proof of work is instant, requiring 1 sha256 and 42 siphash computations.

Runtime in Cuckoo Cycle is completely dominated by memory latency. It promotes the use of commodity general-purpose hardware over custom designed single-purpose hardware.

Other features:

4) proofs take the form of a length 42 cycle in the Cuckoo graph.

5) it has a natural notion of (base) difficulty, namely the number of edges in the graph; above about 60% of size, a 42-cycle is almost guaranteed, but below 50% the probability starts to fall sharply.

6) running time for the current implementation on high end x86 is under 24s/GB single-threaded, and under 3s/GB for 12 threads.

7) making cuckoo use a significant fraction of the typical memory of a botnet computer will send it into swap-hell, and likely alert its owner.

Re: Harvard supercomputing cluster hijacked to mine Dogecoin

#30
post #15

I'm hopeful that future cryptocurrencies won't be so energy-intensive to mine. Bitcoin is already a non-negligible contributor to global CO2 emissions, believe it or not. EDIT: Reversible computing ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_computing ) is a possible way to have computationally difficult proof-of-work while minimizing energy consumption.

How do you make something incapable of being energy-intensive but still difficult? The more computers have to work at something, the more energy they use. I'm not the world's leading expert, but I don't see a way around that.

There is being energy intensive, and then there is being CPU intensive.

You could imagine a hypothetical coin that somehow uses proof of data storage and retrieval instead of proof of work. Producing and running tons of harddrives would still require power, but it would be a less.. direct.. requirement.

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