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Leaving Google

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Re: Leaving Google

#101

Post by zem »

varelse wrote: post #25
officemonkey wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Co-authoring the XML spec probably didn't make him a household word, but I knew who he was from that. People choose "quality-of-life" over "job" all the time, especially when you remove the need to make money from the equation.

I think he made the right call. It's hard for me to imagine him having trouble finding work with 4 years of Google on his resume. That's the tech industry equivalent of being a made man IMO.

he was a very well-known and admired figure in the tech world long before he joined google. in fact his four years there are close to being the least impressive thing on his resume.

Re: Leaving Google

#102

Post by [deleted] »

tobyjsullivan wrote: post #86
haberman wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a little sad he didn't say anything about Seattle, only a couple hours from Vancouver and with sizable and thriving Google offices. It is also has "greens and greys and unfussily variegated people" -- clearly it's not Canada, but in general it would be a much less drastic transition!

This was Google's thought when I was talking to them. "Seattle's only a couple hours away. You could possibly even commute!" I checked out the area through the lens of possibly living there when I went down for my interview. Seattle and Kirkland are not comparable to Vancouver in the slightest. Mostly the ghettos and rampant poverty, combined with the fundamental social differences between the countries. Didn't help…

[deleted]

Re: Leaving Google

#103

Post by turing »

fidotron wrote: post #29
haberman wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a little sad he didn't say anything about Seattle, only a couple hours from Vancouver and with sizable and thriving Google offices. It is also has "greens and greys and unfussily variegated people" -- clearly it's not Canada, but in general it would be a much less drastic transition!

Google are really consolidating in a few offices, mainly MV, NYC, Zurich, possibly London and Tokyo. MV is a whole different ballgame to the other locations and is a world unto itself.

Really? Because Google is in the process of doubling the size of its Kirkland office.

http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2020543320_g...

Re: Leaving Google

#104

Post by skywhopper »

As someone who works 97% remotely from a mostly-colocated office, I have to agree that it's a terribly inefficient way to work. If everyone were remote, it could probably work, but if it's just one or two out of a dozen or a hundred, it's very difficult.

On balance, my current job is still the best choice for me, but there's a constant background of frustration mostly surrounding communication failures.

Re: Leaving Google

#105

Post by philangist »

jpollock wrote: post #76
mathattack wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was going to quote that line too. But is it really that racist? Relative to the rest of the US, it seems remarkably tolerant, no?

I never realized what Scalzi was talking about when he said that being white male was "Easy Mode" until I moved here. Being white is a superpower around here.

Can you expound on this? Is there really that much overt racism in SV?

Re: Leaving Google

#106

Post by aridiculous »

I visited Seattle and Vancouver for the first time recently.

I was surprised at how similar they were. I was expecting Vancouver to be a lot different than it was. Vancouver was even more high-rise, glass-everything, gated-community than Seattle. I spoke with the locals who informed me that was Vancouver's MO, and if I wanted a culturally interesting Canadian city, I should head over to Toronto.

Re: Leaving Google

#107

Post by ChuckFrank »

psbp wrote: post #5

"Plus I find the Bay Area congested, racist, incestuous, and overpriced." I like this guy.

Whereas Vancouver is not? Vancouver is the most congested, racists, incestuous and overpriced market in Canada.

Toronto might be more congested in parts, but it's much less racist and incestuous, and perhaps equally overpriced.

Halifax might be more incestuous.

Calgary might be more racists.

Montreal might be more elitists, but he didn't mention that.

Whereas, in defense of San Francisco, San Francisco has Oakland. It has Fremont. It has Berkeley. It has Richmond. So when you think about San Francisco, you don't have to think about the congested, racists, incestuous and certainly overpriced part. You can think of the whole. Which is far from that. Especially when compared to Vancouver. A rather depressing, squat, shabby and moist city.

My thoughts when I was in Vancouver were 1. If it wasn't for the border ending right here, there'd be no city here. The city here would be Seattle. 2. Vancouver stopped thinking in the 70s. Everything is just a short 70s convenience store building. 3. Yes, the natural beauty is amazing, which is why the city sucks so much. People would rather leave daily. 4. The natives really got it bad here. Never were they defeated like their eastern and southern counterparts, but still they were simply taken over. You can sense their deep frustration with their lack of autonomy and it's a feeling that I think is completely justified. and finally 5. No wonder Heroin is so popular here. I'd do heroin too if I lived here.

But I guess people love where they live. Even if that place is god awfully moist and moldy like Vancouver.

Re: Leaving Google

#108

Post by potatolicious »

tobyjsullivan wrote: post #92
hashberry wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

C'mon troll, Seattle is where people go to make money. Seattle's tech industry beats Vancouver any day.

Times are changing my friend. Who would I go work for in Seattle to "make money" (if that were actually my primary goal)? Amazon? In Vancouver now. Microsoft? In Vancouver now. Facebook? In Vancouver now. Startups? Vancouver has our share. Personally, if I were going to leave the country for a better tech industry, I'd fly right past Seattle and head further south. Sorry, but Seattle just doesn't make sense if you're…

I grew up in Vancouver, lived in Seattle for two years, and agree with all the digs about passive-aggression and the such.

And while Vancouver's tech scene is rising, you should really stop by Seattle some time and see how wide the gap really is, and how far Vancouver has to go to even be within the same league as Seattle when it comes to tech employment.

> "Amazon? In Vancouver now. Microsoft? In Vancouver now. Facebook? In Vancouver now."

Amazon is the only real dev office out of those. Microsoft and Facebook are waiting rooms for Canadian citizenship to permit easier access to the US. It's funny how often these exact companies are trotted out in defense of Vancouver's tech industry when considering why these offices exist in the first place (tip: it's not to access Vancouver's existing tech talent).

> "Sorry, but Seattle just doesn't make sense if you're not already there."

I don't like the city much at all, but where else can a fresh CS undergrad fetch a $100K+ offer without paying $2K a month for a dingy studio apartment? Vancouver's rental market just as expensive as Seattle, and salaries far, far lower.

The tech industry gets better the further south you go along the west coast. Vancouver is not an exception to this rule.

Re: Leaving Google

#109

Post by Jack000 »

dubfan wrote: post #94
tobyjsullivan wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was Google's thought when I was talking to them. "Seattle's only a couple hours away. You could possibly even commute!" I checked out the area through the lens of possibly living there when I went down for my interview. Seattle and Kirkland are not comparable to Vancouver in the slightest. Mostly the ghettos and rampant poverty, combined with the fundamental social differences between the countries. Didn't help…

Seattle doesn't have ghettos. Seriously, compare Oakland or south-central LA to Seattle's "ghettos" and tell me they are similar. Vancouver's Downtown Eastside had the worst concentration of poverty and desperation I'd ever seen in North America while I lived in Vancouver.

Vancouver's poverty is kind of odd and I think not entirely comparable to other areas. It's concentrated in just a couple of blocks on hastings, in a highly visible area. The overall homeless rate is actually higher in less populous municipalities like Abbotsford. It's also not a "violent" ghetto, I've never felt unsafe walking down that stretch of road, compared to some of the places I've been in the US.

Re: Leaving Google

#110

Post by tobyjsullivan »

dubfan wrote: post #94
tobyjsullivan wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was Google's thought when I was talking to them. "Seattle's only a couple hours away. You could possibly even commute!" I checked out the area through the lens of possibly living there when I went down for my interview. Seattle and Kirkland are not comparable to Vancouver in the slightest. Mostly the ghettos and rampant poverty, combined with the fundamental social differences between the countries. Didn't help…

Seattle doesn't have ghettos. Seriously, compare Oakland or south-central LA to Seattle's "ghettos" and tell me they are similar. Vancouver's Downtown Eastside had the worst concentration of poverty and desperation I'd ever seen in North America while I lived in Vancouver.

I probably misused the word ghetto there (forgetting some parts of America have real ghettos).

The word I should be using is poverty. It's rampant and seems to be everywhere. You can mostly avoid it if you stick to the very central downtown core which I always did as a tourist.

But that was definitely just my impression of the city. I'm not damning the city for it, everywhere has problems. I just can't imagine living around that would have a positive long-term effect on anyone's state of mind. It's not where I would chose to be.

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