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Vienna again named world's most liveable city

reuters.com

11–20 of 119 posts

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#11
I live in Vienna and I see these surveys all the time. I moved in Vienna 2.5 years ago. Vienna is a good place to live (otherwise I would have left) provided you don't care about things that are simply not available, for example no real IT sector, no startup scene etc. It's okay, but it's nothing spectacular. I don't understand what these people find so fascinating about the city. My friends share my opinion too.

I guess the people doing the surveys simply care about completely different things in life compared to myself. I read their impressions, and I either don't care about those things at all, or I find them completely wrong. The reviewer simply has different expectations than myself. For example, a couple of week ago I've seen another article like this. Among other things, the author liked the huge variety of beers and cheese found in Vienna. I don't know exactly why this matters for such a survey but whatever. Anyway, I happen to be somewhat of a beer and cheese aficionado and in my opinion Austrian beer is terrible, bland, and all the same. Go to Belgium to find good beer. There are not too many types of beer. And don't get me started on the cheese.

Of course these things are subjective things, but because they are subjective things they have no place in such an article.

Other issues are more subtle, for example, nice people. Every article claims Vienna has nice people but doesn't divulge either the nationality and cultural background of the reviewer, nor the way said reviewer interacted with viennese people. For example I don't find anything nice about viennese people because I grew in a country where attributes associated with nice people are different than Austrian attributes about nice people. These people may be nice, I'm sure they are, but I don't see it. Similarly, I'm sure they see me as a misanthropic, asocial, arrogant individual.

It's the same like with restaurants, an american will complain that european restaurant service is precarious, I will complain that the western-european restaurant service is annoying and offensive. The cultural background is different, expectations in social settings are different. Articles like this skip over all this stuff.

Anyway, there are some really nice things in Vienna but no article I've seen mentioned them. They are subjective things, but most of what these article say is subjective.

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#12
post #8

Don't forget that there are multiple "most liveable cities", according to different reports. Melbourne ranked world's most liveable city - again http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-news/melbourne-ranked-wo...

This is common in many industries as well. Practically every car model gets awarded "Best XYZ 2014!". I have definitely noticed the trend with companies in my area, of which 5 seem to all hold the title of "Best Place to Work".

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#13
post #2

I've actually been thinking of moving to Vienna. Anybody in Vienna have a moment to type out some thoughts on what it's like to live there?

In general it's quite nice. As a viennese native living abroad, i especially miss the public transport system and some of the theaters. Vienna also has far less social segregation than other cities of it's size (~2M), looks extremely clean is quite safe. Do you have any more specific questions? You can post them here or contact me per jabber/email (in my profile) if you want.

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#14
On these "most livable" city indexes, I wish they would take into account how much it costs to live there compared to wages. San Fransisco is high on their list, but from what I'm hearing, it's really not the panacea that these lists often make it out to be. High wages, but higher cost of living and horrible living conditions compared to the Midwest, for example. I have a friend who just bought a two-story, four bedroom house with two acres of land in a nice area of Beer City, USA (Grand Rapids, Michigan) for $90,000, and has a 10 mile, 10 minute commute to a downtown office where he's making $70,000/yr. He can drive his own car and find a place to park in a nicely cultural city of ~200,000.

I don't live in Grand Rapids, but if I were moving somewhere I'd be looking for a city like that. That is what I would consider highly livable. Can you find a two-story house with an acre or more of land in SF for not much more than your yearly salary? I want a list of cities where salary and cost of living are taken into account along with culture and safety.

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#15
post #11

I live in Vienna and I see these surveys all the time. I moved in Vienna 2.5 years ago. Vienna is a good place to live (otherwise I would have left) provided you don't care about things that are simply not available, for example no real IT sector, no startup scene etc. It's okay, but it's nothing spectacular. I don't understand what these people find so fascinating about the city. My friends share my opinion too. I g…

You are probably right. However, presumably we tend to underestimate how horrible most places in the world really are. Compared to the average city, perhaps Vienna really is quite good.

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#16
post #4
post #2

I've actually been thinking of moving to Vienna. Anybody in Vienna have a moment to type out some thoughts on what it's like to live there?

the good thing about vienna (or maybe austria) is that it's the biggests city in austria. if something interesting is going on in austria, most often it's happening in vienna. (culturally, jobwise, universitywise,...). so austria is very centered around vienna in my experience.

Also, it used to be part of a much larger country, wasn't it (Austria+Hungary)? I've been there only many years ago, but somehow I had the impression of a slightly multicultural air about it.

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#17
post #2

I've actually been thinking of moving to Vienna. Anybody in Vienna have a moment to type out some thoughts on what it's like to live there?

Like many typical Austrians/Viennese I've got a love/hate relationship with Austria/Vienna.

On the one hand it's very gemütlich (cosy/comfy -> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemütlichkeit) to live here but on the other hand it can be quite boring as even very young people often act like they are already retired. I believe there aren't many places in the world where you enjoy as much actual freedom as you do in Austria but people mostly don't make much use of it, good luck with getting people engaged in anything interesting (maybe life here is already too comfortable).

Not having the cultural "baggage" of having gotten pampered your whole life, Vienna could very well be the ideal place to be as you might be able to actually enjoy its benefits.

You should definitely come and visit, there is tons of stuff to see - it's somewhat of a cultural Disney Land with an amazing history. While doing so you could dip your toes into what it would mean to live here, there are quite some Americans around who really like it and have been living here for many years.

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#18
The more I travel, the more convinced I am that the American experiment with car oriented cities was a disaster that will take untold billions of dollars to rectify. It's affected everything from public safety (e.g. police can no longer walk a patrol), to loss of community (people don't really shop in the same place they live), lost productivity (stuck in traffic), and on and on and on.

I'm very encouraged by recent, walkable focused, mixed-use development around mass transit stops in the DC area. If they're successful, they could quickly pay back the tax dollars spent getting the transit built, and lead to a model for development in the U.S. In other words, they're building more classic European style city centers, but as all new construction, and even better, informed by the mistakes and success of the last few decades.

I'm not sure it would ever get rid of the suburb (there's too many reasons to not want to raise your children in the city), but there's innovation there too. Many newer suburbs are being built with walkability in mind, usually with a small commercial core with groceries, a coffee shop, laundry and a few restaurants, many have mass transit shuttle stops and commuter lots nearby and with telecommuting becoming more common, there's less of a need to make the daily drive. I live in a suburb like this and have at least a dozen restaurants (from fast food to high end), two coffee shops, laundry, a gym, a Tae Kwon Do school, a bike shop, 2 ice cream parlors, a grocery, a movie theater a couple salons, a music shop, a medical practice, dentist, chiropractor, orthodontist, optometrist, liquor store, a bank and more within a short, comfortable 5-10 minute walk from my house. I'm also surrounded by green space and parks, schools and swimming pools are walkable and we're planning on building out space for a public library and other amenities soon. I telecommute most days and if I have to go to work I take the bus into the city. Other than my weekly client site visits I pretty much don't drive my car. In my region, this development model accounts for easily 40-50% of the new developments.

European cities aren't without problems (awkward living accommodations in old buildings, lack of handicapped or elderly accessibility, etc.), but remind us that before the auto lobby took over and screwed up urban design, cities could be built to high density, very livable, very human scale and that doing so makes wonderful places to live and work.

Re: Vienna again named world's most liveable city

#19

On these "most livable" city indexes, I wish they would take into account how much it costs to live there compared to wages. San Fransisco is high on their list, but from what I'm hearing, it's really not the panacea that these lists often make it out to be. High wages, but higher cost of living and horrible living conditions compared to the Midwest, for example. I have a friend who just bought a two-story, four bedr…

Living conditions? The midwest has been and is still being hit with one of the worst winters in a few decades.

Also I hear that "land is cheap elsewhere" argument all the time. You're right; if I was 82 and wanted to settle down I'd buy a ranch somewhere in the palm desert for 100k, but I'm not. I'm young and I want to work. I'll live in my shitty apartment in SF long before I whither away on some plot of land in the midwest any day.

Yes there are cheap houses in swamplands; probably a dollar an acre. But then what? Cool I have cheap house totally removed from all the action.

However, if that's your thing then do it.

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