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Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

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Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#191

Post by vlangber »

chrislomax wrote: post #12
maresca wrote: post #5

C# and .NET get a bad rap for being created by Microsoft. But one thing that can't be ignored is how polished their development tools are. I absolutely love coding in Visual Studio.

It pains me if I am honest. Our CMS is built on .NET and it's like an uphill battle selling it as it's on IIS and it's .NET. I have played around with the idea of reworking it into an open source language and open source database but I would miss Visual Studio and the language a lot. I don't get all the hate?

.Net is the most popular platform for commercial content management systems($2k->$100k license), with SiteCore, EpiServer, Kentico, Sitefinity and Ektron leading the pack.

If you have problems selling due to the platform, I think the main issue is your target market, and not .Net in itself.

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#193

Post by mattmanser »

ehaughee wrote: post #171
breischl wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried out Resharper for the entire evaluation period and then dropped it. There were a few nice things, but nothing that was just leaps and bounds better than built in VS features. But everyone says it's necessary, so I keep wondering if I somehow missed the killer features. What are the features of Resharper that make you say VS isn't complete without it?

In my experience it isn't one, two, or even three killer features. It's the aggregate additional polish and productivity increase gleaned from 10 to 20 minor features that shave fractions of seconds and remove a click or two off of incredibly common actions. And I just use the default settings.

I've tried it a few times now, and never stuck with it.

I think it's because I find the VS interface incredibly cluttered anyway, and Resharper just makes it worse. The right click menus are already 10 miles long filled with useless clutter and when it starts mucking around with the already edging towards overwhelming intellisense pop-ups it just annoyed me one too many time.

After 2 weeks of trialling it then only thing I was really using was the "go to implementation..." but I've long since given up on the ridiculousness of making everything mockable anyway so it's only occasionally useful.

The worst thing about VS is how slow it can be sometimes, even on incredibly powerful machines. In the end it's a glorified text editor and everything should be secondary to that.

There's nothing more annoying than pressing ctrl-f (find) and then have it pause for 1/2 a second because it's trying to parse a massive html tree for intellisense you don't even need because you're just trying to delete a single node you know the name of.

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#194

Post by LordIllidan »

Moto7451 wrote: post #150
michaelmior wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about Mono? I have no idea how practical this is for real code bases, but I've used it successfully on several smaller projects.

I have Mono projects in production. Xamarin Studio is pretty nice these days. I don't have a lot of performance sensitive .Net code so I don't notice any real difference between Microsoft's and Xamarin's implementations. One problem I'm running into at the moment is I'm trying to port a vendor's reference SOAP Service over to Mono/Linux and their provided secret sauce DLL is blowing up when calling their objects' con…

Personally, I find Xamarin Studio to be quite buggy, often needing several quit+restart a day (I do iPhone apps), a colleague also does Android apps with Xamarin (on Windows) and experiences similar problems.

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#195

Post by thomasz »

d0 wrote: post #190
300bps wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The old IIS is like you describe. But, the latest IIS is fast and easy. In all honesty this is what I find from most unknowledgeable Microsoft bashers. They tried out the MS development stack with Classic ASP, Visual Basic 6 and SourceSafe 15 years ago. Then in their head they're contrasting that to the latest RoR tools with github. Many are not even aware of ASP.NET MVC and how different it is from ASP.NET. Now, thi…

As a knowledgeable Microsoft basher, you're right. MVC is better but still a long step away from something great. Some of the internals are crazy bad from attribute thread safety to the numerous singleton piles of crud like the ViewEngines collection and route data. Not only that, the tooling really doesn't scale up well either. I can only say after managing a project with 400 controllers that it doesn't scale up to…

I feel exactly the same way, but we should be aware that the grass is always greener on the other side.

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#196

Post by danabramov »

To those who insist this somehow encourages copy-paste style of programming, think again. What would this so-called programmer do if they didn't have this extension? They'd put this question in Google and copy the first example that works.

This extension doesn't “spoil” programmers any more than Google does. And if you hire this kind of programmers, this is very likely a problem of yours.

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#197

Post by alkonaut »

mattmanser wrote: post #193
ehaughee wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience it isn't one, two, or even three killer features. It's the aggregate additional polish and productivity increase gleaned from 10 to 20 minor features that shave fractions of seconds and remove a click or two off of incredibly common actions. And I just use the default settings.

I've tried it a few times now, and never stuck with it. I think it's because I find the VS interface incredibly cluttered anyway, and Resharper just makes it worse. The right click menus are already 10 miles long filled with useless clutter and when it starts mucking around with the already edging towards overwhelming intellisense pop-ups it just annoyed me one too many time. After 2 weeks of trialling it then only t…

I agree the slowness of find (Ctrl+F) and the slowness of the xml/html parsers is still the worse thing about it. I can see how tag soup is hard to parse, but well formed xml should parse in milliseconds. On the bright side, with a good go-to-symbol, go-to-file, go-to-type etc., I search much less for free text.

The text editor is only a tiny part of an IDE, the bits that are added are quite important. Integrated debugging (with edit+continue while debugging), integrated version control interface, integrated build system, integrated profiler and much more makes it so much more productive than having to e.g. do debugging with recompile/restart turnaround times.

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#198

Post by UK-AL »

d0 wrote: post #190
300bps wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The old IIS is like you describe. But, the latest IIS is fast and easy. In all honesty this is what I find from most unknowledgeable Microsoft bashers. They tried out the MS development stack with Classic ASP, Visual Basic 6 and SourceSafe 15 years ago. Then in their head they're contrasting that to the latest RoR tools with github. Many are not even aware of ASP.NET MVC and how different it is from ASP.NET. Now, thi…

As a knowledgeable Microsoft basher, you're right. MVC is better but still a long step away from something great. Some of the internals are crazy bad from attribute thread safety to the numerous singleton piles of crud like the ViewEngines collection and route data. Not only that, the tooling really doesn't scale up well either. I can only say after managing a project with 400 controllers that it doesn't scale up to…

WTF?

You complain about singletons, then prefer a language where the use of [sharedInstance] is extremely common. Objective-C is singleton hell. Both in third party code, and core libaries.

C# is vastly nicer than objective-c, and I'm a iOS developer. I'd rather use C# or Scala with a IoC container to handle the lifetime of objects, rather than using singletons.

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#199

Post by cadab »

AlaShiban wrote: post #3

If you want more info about the extension let us know. There's alot of cool contextual and semantic pieces in there that makes it a smarter search

I just tried the web demo and loved it, so added it to visual studio, but now it works different. I really liked the /// search term [tab] idea.

Now i have to [ctrl] + [space], click on how do i, then search. Is there an easier keyboard only way like your web example?

Re: Introducing Bing Code Search for C#

#200

Post by de90 »

jmspring wrote: post #141
magic_haze wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need to click on the "Export" button, at the top right corner of the page: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/export/help/?returnU...

I've seen that, a page at a time. If I do the following google search "developer.apple.com keychain", it gives me a web browsable version with a pdf link in the upper right. If I click the PDF link, I get the content for "every page" which means, in this case, the "keychain services programming guide". I have yet to be able to do the same under msdn.

In visual studio go to Help -> "Add and remove help content" and that will allow you to download entire topics like .net 4.5 docs.

You can even throw whatever you download on a network, and anyone can access it from there rather than individually needing to download it. That requires setting something in the registry though to access from the network (let me know if you want to know though).

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