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How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

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Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#591

Post by vacri »

bsimpson wrote: post #222
owenjones wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I was a student living in a "gentrifying" part of the city, I once went outside to discover my car was full of bullets. Several in the hood, several through the windows, one in the rear tire and most disconcertingly one in the driver side headrest. When I called the police and the investigator came, I could tell I was instantly suspect #1. He began grilling me lengthily about my whereabouts the night before and…

Where were you last night? Shooting holes in my own car so I could waste 20 minutes of your time. Why do you ask?

Wasting time reminds me of a positive story about cops: At 3am, some guys thew a hammer through my driver-side window and tried to take my car to go street racing (it looked faster than it was...). The idiots jammed the handbrake on and couldn't release it. The endless revving of the engine woke up my housemate, who scared them off, then called the cops, then woke me up.

I was annoyed. Great, now we have to wait an hour for the cops to show up, and they're going to be pissed off that they had to leave the comfortable station to waste time dealing with something that they can't do anything about. Broken sleep, broken window, and now I have to manage an interaction with grumpy police.

The cops that arrived showed empathy. Yes, they couldn't do anything about it, but their underlying tone was "this was a shitty thing to have happened" rather than "why the fuck are you wasting our time". I was so taken aback by the shift in tone that I actually said the line, corny as it is, "I've lived here for 11 years and this is the first time I've had a positive experience with the Fitzroy police"

The cop searching with a torch behind my car doubled over in silent laughter while the one in front of me smirked "Actually, we're from Collingwood..."

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#592

Post by lostlogin »

judk wrote: post #479
dllthomas wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it sad that the officer could be a "joke around the precinct" - presumably incompetent and apparently eager to abuse their power - and still be an officer.

In Seattle, 120 strikes and you're out: http://petapixel.com/2014/02/04/police-officer-threatened-ar...

I know it's just 2 photos, but that body language serves the story well. It's very threatening. I know glasses are needed to look after eyes, but when talking with someone you don't know, take them off. Especially when in a position of authority.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#593

Post by aeturnum »

yscale wrote: post #206
josh2600 wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's rational for a police officer to respond to civil disobedience in some circumstances with detention. That is not unreasonable in some situations, particularly one where lives are at stake or where there is clear and present danger. My point is that while the arrest may have been bad, what happened after is egregious and clearly definable as awful. There's lots of blame to go around here but blame does little goo…

Your comment reads like this: "It's rational for officers to arrest law-abiding citizens who are slightly annoying officers." And I get that a lot of people believe that. But you're wrong. You're so, so wrong. It saddens me that a lot of cops (like the one in this story) feel as you do, that it's fine for police to grossly abuse their powers. In a rational world, the cop would no longer be a cop. In this world, he pr…

I'm not the person you're replaying to and I don't think that someone should be arrested in the described situation, but I think the logic follows like this.

Police are the people we've put in charge with keeping public order. In the course of that job, they're going to arrest and / or detain people. We want them to always detain the right people, but even a very good police department will detain the wrong people sometimes. So, we give the authority to individual officers to detain people, and we don't second guess their decisions at the time.

Of course, this system only works when there is a functioning review system. Where the policed populace feels like their concerns are listened to by the authority figures. Where officers who misbehave, even by the loose standards of american police, are publicly disciplined. None of these things are common in modern america - but you can still believe in the right for police to detain people and push for better accountability.

I think you should consider how much you are reading into statements before you ascribe particular views to people. You both agree the author was treated deplorably, and you both agree (I assume) that police can do better.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#594

Post by wutbrodo »

coldtea wrote: post #552
debt wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole idea that bicyclists somehow are above the law in terms of traffic signals needs to end. We need to start stopping at red lights and stop signs if we're ever to be taken seriously. Time and again I've had conversations with bicyclists friends of mine who are adamant about how helmets are as optional as obeying traffic signals; it's totally hypocritical and asinine. They knowingly break the laws then bitch a…

> All because you blew a red light, which by the way is basically instantly a ticket if you're in a car, and couldn't immediately admit wrongdoing and move on. Sorry, if you were a buddy of mine telling me that story, I'd tell you you were a moron for deciding to "educate" the police officer. So, the "american way" you propose is to BEND OVER and take abuse and injustice from police officers? You sure are pragmatic -…

The abuse and injustice is irrelevant at that point because it hasn't happened. What 'debt' is saying is that it was a stupid reaction to getting stopped for a red light violation, not that the abuse that followed was justified. Those two views are not contradictory.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#595

Post by thret »

greenyoda wrote: post #369
fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adrian Schoolcraft, a good cop. Pay attention to how he was treated.

A summary of Schoolcraft's ordeal can be found in the Wikipedia article about him:[1] " After voicing his concerns, Schoolcraft was reportedly harassed and reassigned to a desk job. After he left work early one day, a SWAT unit illegally entered his apartment, physically abducted him and forcibly admitted him to a psychiatric facility, where he was held against his will for six days. " But Schoolcraft was expecting t…

So The Wire basically had it right, they really do just play a numbers game? Comforting.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#596

Post by lostlogin »

pbreit wrote: post #501
herbig wrote: post #240

Back in November, I was arrested in Brooklyn for running a red light on my bike while on my way to work in Manhattan. Normally you're given a ticket and let go, but in this instance, the officers took issue with the fact that I was not carrying ID. Both officers told me that I "could be arrested for not having ID." For clarification, I asked if it was a city, state, or national law, and the officers adamantly maintai…

Sounds like there is one major thing you did NOT learn: STFU!!! Why the heck would you engage in some much conversation with all the other random officers??

It's not like that everywhere. I live in New Zealand, and have chatted with police at length even when they are there to get us to move along (as teenagers skating and bmxing). Yes, there are shameful episodes (Louise Nicholas, accidental shooting on Auckland motorway, Arthur Allan Thomas, et al), however by and large, it seems to mostly be the older generation of police that are/were involved. I have no fear of police here and I don't know anyone that does.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#597

Post by aeturnum »

krisdol wrote: post #489
Lagged2Death wrote: post #51

It's high time to just make the cops wear video cameras. A whole lot of this sort of crap could just vanish.

That evidence will never be available to be used against cops. This was in Texas. I don't recall the exact details. My bosnian friend was racially profiled (as hispanic) by the police. He was ticketed after not coming to a full stop, then arrested because the officer incorrectly assumed that his real driver's license was fake and that he was not a legal citizen. At the precinct, he was told some racist stuff by a wor…

Some police departments wear them, and they dramatically (~80% iirc) reduce complaints / reports by citizens. You can only have video footage go missing so many times before it starts to get old for judges / the media / etc.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#598

Post by jabr »

williamcotton wrote: post #282
nkurz wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of this is some sort of thinly veiled attack on our public servants and what seems to be public government infrastructure in general. Why would you think he's kidding? I don't see a veiled attack: I see desperation. He (and others in this thread) believe that you are putting yourself into greater risk by calling 911 than by solving the situation any other way you can. I don't share their opinion, but I would thin…

Again, that is terrible advice. Literally all professional literature on the subject suggests the following: Remain calm, be aware of your surroundings, and closely evaluate the scene to protect yourself and others from further injury. Do not move a critically injured person unless instructed by emergency medical professionals. Do not try to drive someone who is critically ill or injured to a hospital unless there is…

You apparently missed the part where he did all of that, and then ended up naked in solitary for 12 hours.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#599

Post by wutbrodo »

csense wrote: post #541
thaumasiotes wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't believe that a state born of brutality can be anything other than brutal. This is kind of a funny sentiment. Can you name a state that wasn't born of brutality?

Um...we peacefully purchased Alaska from the Russians.

I'm pretty sure that that's not the sense that "state" is being used here. He's talking about sovereign states; Alaska is subordinate to America (a sovereign state) which is evident in the fact that it was purchased by America.

Re: How I Ended Up In Solitary After Calling 911 For Help

#600

Post by downandout »

growupkids wrote: post #544
herbig wrote: post #240

Back in November, I was arrested in Brooklyn for running a red light on my bike while on my way to work in Manhattan. Normally you're given a ticket and let go, but in this instance, the officers took issue with the fact that I was not carrying ID. Both officers told me that I "could be arrested for not having ID." For clarification, I asked if it was a city, state, or national law, and the officers adamantly maintai…

I'm terribly sorry this happened to you. For what it's worth you can sue, and you can get money for your trouble and maybe even cause the police department to change it's policies. I did it back in 2000 with the MPD, it took almost 8 years in the courts but eventually I got justice. If you roll over, the bad cops will just keep doing what they do. You'd be surprised at all the law firms that will take your case for f…

In my experience there aren't many cases against government entities that attorneys will take on contingency. A friend of mine was held for nearly 2 years without bail because he was deemed a flight risk (the white collar charges he faced were eventually dropped). He spent most of that time experiencing violent and painful vomiting attacks. He was told he had an ulcer and was given ulcer medication that had no effect on the attacks.

Upon his release, he immediately went to an ER where he was told he had developed gallstones and that it had gone on so long that it was affecting his other organs. His pancreas was on the verge of shutting down. He was told that it was good that he came in when he did, as he would have been dead in another month or so. It was eventually revealed that the gallstones diagnosis had been made by the jail doctor approximately 16 months before his release, and that he had recommended a surgery be scheduled. That never happened and he was never told about the diagnosis. At one point during his incarceration, his attorney requested bail based on the jail's inability to properly diagnose/treat the problem. The prosecutor mocked the request in open court, saying he "had stomach pains sometimes too" and the judge denied the renewed bail request because jail staffers insisted that they were doing everything medically reasonable.

I helped him contact probably 50 attorneys. Not a single one would take the case on contingency, mainly because there was no permanent injury or death that had occurred. The government got away with nearly killing my friend while he was being held without bond on charges that were ultimately dismissed.

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