Live data from Hacker News

The Book of Graham

leveragedsellout.com

101–110 of 125 posts

Re: The Book of Graham

#101
post #87

Don't work with PG, he's evil! Come and work on Wall Street and be evil yourself.

I interpreted this piece of satire attacking both industries. I don't think the author's intention is to state the Wall Street is better.

Re: The Book of Graham

#102

I don't know to what extent this is a joke but I am not laughing. Yc is a school where they pay you, Paul Graham et al did not take over Airbnb or Dropbox... the people who founded those companies run them. The idea that a life is worthless or wasted if you make less money is beyond flawed. It is the most american/capitalist/rewarding thing to make a go of building something of your own. Being a wall street banker ha…

On the subject of women who love passionate startup founders, did you see his previous vignette?

  http://www.leveragedsellout.com/2014/01/the-founder-hounder/
/ducks

Re: The Book of Graham

#104
It's interesting how one can take any phenomena and demonize the actors playing in it.

The author focuses on the tangible benefits of working at a startup vs. working in finance (e.g. corporate card, company car, free food), but leaves out the journey which drive so many entrepreneurs to continue to do what they do and what ultimately makes many of them come alive.

It's a stark contrast to finance where many engage in soul-crushing work and anxiously await their bonuses, so they can find a more fulfilling job.

Entertaining read.

Re: The Book of Graham

#105
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A side note: If you claim that people are missing the point, then you need to state that point (and why). Otherwise you're just leaving those people confused and/or angry.

I thought the point was made clear that it's a satirical website?

And what is the point that the satire makes? Just saying that something is "satire" or "sarcasm" is a total cop-out.

Re: The Book of Graham

#106
post #83
post #36

This was surprisingly entertaining. There's some truth to it, but it essentially misses three things: 1) The intangible benefits of being at a startup (as a founder or early employee) -- working on interesting problems, with smart people, in a well funded environment. You learn things, meet people, get to use amazing tools. (Startups definitely aren't the only way to do this -- academia or, for engineering, some part…

I think you're responding to just one part of the claim, namely that a person would be better off doing something else than a startup. The more interesting point, I think, is not the entrepreneur side of the equation, but the YC side. The author claims that YC is exploiting entrepreneurs. This claim is more interesting (in the social-studies sense) as it seeks to uncover a particular kind of exploitation that's a fea…

That's a bad example. I read your island example and thought to myself: "that's not exploitation." Is there a specific reason you think it's exploitation?

Re: The Book of Graham

#107
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Or just buy a lottery ticket. I'd argue the odds are much similar, with much less effort. No one pays you a salary to buy lottery tickets. Wage income or RSUs from Google, Apple, etc. are pretty low risk. Wage income and options from a post-B successful company are pretty low risk, too (e.g. if you're an IT guy at Dropbox, you probably make $80-120k in salary, and the bar to be hired as an internal IT support perso…

"...a startling 93% of the companies that get accepted by Y Combinator eventually fail.": http://www.businessinsider.com/startup-odds-of-success-2013-... Good luck picking that 7% that won't, AND that's only Y Combinator startups. Lottery tickets it is.

Did you even read the article carefully? The 7% figure corresponds to $40MM+ exits for YC. There are a huge, absolutely huge number of YC startups that get acquired for less than that. Many of those are acquihires ($rdl is suggesting you pick top startups that are post Series B and which already have multi-hundred-million to billion dollar valuations (think: Stripe, Pinterest, Airbnb). He is not suggesting you join a 5 person YC startup that is still trying to get product market fit. Hugely different categories. rdl is essentially suggesting you work for the roughly one YC company out of every batch that becomes a great success - and that you make that leap when the startup had already proved itself.

From reading your other posts it seems like you are willfully misunderstanding his point.

Re: The Book of Graham

#109
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're responding to just one part of the claim, namely that a person would be better off doing something else than a startup. The more interesting point, I think, is not the entrepreneur side of the equation, but the YC side. The author claims that YC is exploiting entrepreneurs. This claim is more interesting (in the social-studies sense) as it seeks to uncover a particular kind of exploitation that's a fea…

That's a bad example. I read your island example and thought to myself: "that's not exploitation." Is there a specific reason you think it's exploitation?

Certainly. Exploitation is taking advantage of the other party's lack of options – which results in its lack of bargaining power – for an unfair distribution, in this case the workers get far below their contribution, even when adjusting for the capitalist's risk. The meager payment ensures the workers will never have options.

The theoretical economic model for this case is the dictator game[1]. In the dictator game, one player receives an amount of money, and he has to offer the second player a portion of it. If the second player rejects the offer, neither gets any money. Often, the only distribution accepted will be 50% or close to it, but when a rich person plays a very poor person, the rich person knows that the poor player will take any offer rather than go home empty-handed. That's exploitation.

Now, a misguided free-market advocate, not familiar with both theory and practice might say that the islanders do have bargaining power, as they can invite another employer to their island in exchange for a loaf of bread plus a burger per day. But, of course, this can't happen, as the second capitalist knows the first will retaliate on their own islands. This is a digression, but in fact, in a saturated market, the best strategy for competitors of roughly equal size (even quite far from equal) is almost never to compete, certainly not on price. Lowering prices is not an option as your competitor has the resources to do the same, which will result in the same market distribution, only with all competitors worse off. Again, this is supported both by theory and practice.

FYI, a lot of the regulation in the US government came as a result of the US economy under the rule of the robber barons a little over one hundred years ago. Similar to the island story, some employers would pay their employees not in US dollars, but in their own currency, which the workers could only use in stores owned by the employer ("the company store").

Of course, the situation in Silicon Valley is not that of full blown exploitation, since startup founders are not without options. Still, large tech companies benefit from the lottery model, as they profit more from it than from large research departments; the founders, on the other hand, get an unfair share of the cake. In this case, the large companies are not exploiting the entrepreneurs lack of options, but are simply taking advantage of their psychological preference for the lottery. There is more to that, as all parties know that if the lottery were to go away (say VC money stops), and everyone would have to work for the large companies, salaries would drop (that's a sort of a sword those companies hold over the workers should anyone decide to rebel). We don't even need to speculate, as we know that large SV employers already colluded to lower salaries.

Re: The Book of Graham

#110
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought the point was made clear that it's a satirical website?

And what is the point that the satire makes? Just saying that something is "satire" or "sarcasm" is a total cop-out.

Satire makes people laugh at the absurdity of things, by means of exageration.

The point of satire is not always to "make a point". I don't think it is in this case anyway. But if you really want to see something you could see a criticism of the startup ecosystem that "puts bright people to work by making them shuffle bits of questionable value".

Post reply on HN