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Is the shared economy racist?

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Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#21

Post by spikels »

rayiner wrote: post #18
joesmo wrote: post #12

I don't think any of this is specific to AirBnb or Uber. What is described here is just plain racism, something that's blatant all over America (some might say, it's what defines America), especially in regards towards black people. The black friend in the story knew this and wasn't surprised. It's only surprising to people who think this is something of the past, as if somehow people have improved and this shouldn't…

The difference is that you can sue Hyatt if you are discriminated against, which keeps people in line. It's very difficult to sue AirBnB for the actions of a host.

You could sue the host. But that violates the rule that you only sue people with money. There are not many but this is one disadvantage of wealth.

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#22

Post by mhurron »

rayiner wrote: post #7

There's a really simple explanatory mechanism, which is that even if an AirBnB host is bound by the same anti-discrimination provisions of the Civil Rights Act as a Hyatt, which is probably true, holding individual service providers accountable at that level is basically impossible. And to the extent that the "sharing economy" involves more individuals rather than businesses that can be sued, you will see more discri…

> I think Americans are much less racist than almost anyone else. I'm Bengali by ethnicity, and my observation is that people on the subcontinent are racist enough to make a south Georgia redneck blush.

Not really, it's just in the rest of the world being openly racist is just fine, in the US (and Canada) you have to pick when you can be openly racist and pretend otherwise the rest of the time.

> think we'd still have legal segregation if the courts hadn't forced it down peoples' throats.

We would.

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#23

Post by wyager »

joesmo wrote: post #12

I don't think any of this is specific to AirBnb or Uber. What is described here is just plain racism, something that's blatant all over America (some might say, it's what defines America), especially in regards towards black people. The black friend in the story knew this and wasn't surprised. It's only surprising to people who think this is something of the past, as if somehow people have improved and this shouldn't…

> plain racism, something that's blatant all over America (some might say, it's what defines America)

Have you ever lived in any continental European country? As someone who has spent about half their life in northern and western Europe and the other half in America, I can tell you with 100% confidence that Europeans are, in general, more xenophobic and racist than Americans.

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#24

Post by jaredsohn »

steven2012 wrote: post #8
rayiner wrote: post #7

There's a really simple explanatory mechanism, which is that even if an AirBnB host is bound by the same anti-discrimination provisions of the Civil Rights Act as a Hyatt, which is probably true, holding individual service providers accountable at that level is basically impossible. And to the extent that the "sharing economy" involves more individuals rather than businesses that can be sued, you will see more discri…

Impossible? That's nonsense. They could ask users for a standard race descriptor that is never shared with the hosts, and if the hosts seem to predominantly reject certain races of people, the marketplace like AirBnB could kick them out. It's actually pretty simple. It all depends on how eager the marketplaces are to solve this particular problem.

A nice aspect of this is that it could work better than the system being replaced (tracking gets automated and centralized.)

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#25

Post by greendata »

This is so depressing and even though sample size is small it rings 100% true. I think it's just a symptom of an inherently racist and unfair world and is not Uber or Airbnb's fault. The same thing happens with names at the resume level and on and on.

That said I think there's a new market here. If the average Airbnb listing is rejecting applicants of color maybe there could be a special "diversity friendly" designation on Airbnb or other sites. Perhaps users could add some flair, something similar to the LGBT pride flag that some business add to their windows, to their profiles to signify they sincerely welcome all applicants. Hopefully this doesn't sound too ignorant.

If mass rejection of specific groups is occurring, there's some money to be made here by sending out the right signals. Just think of the profit made by some gay/lesbian bars in the 1970s and 80s.

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#26

Post by afterburner »

gizmo686 wrote: post #20
joesmo wrote: post #12

I don't think any of this is specific to AirBnb or Uber. What is described here is just plain racism, something that's blatant all over America (some might say, it's what defines America), especially in regards towards black people. The black friend in the story knew this and wasn't surprised. It's only surprising to people who think this is something of the past, as if somehow people have improved and this shouldn't…

People as a whole have been getting less racist. The only problem is that "less racist" still is not as good as many people think it is.

People are also more racist than normal when their assets are on the line (aka paranoia).

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#27

Post by TillE »

jsonne wrote: post #17
rayiner wrote: post #7

There's a really simple explanatory mechanism, which is that even if an AirBnB host is bound by the same anti-discrimination provisions of the Civil Rights Act as a Hyatt, which is probably true, holding individual service providers accountable at that level is basically impossible. And to the extent that the "sharing economy" involves more individuals rather than businesses that can be sued, you will see more discri…

"The elimination of overt racial discrimination in private businesses is actually a wonderful example of concerted government action addressing a problem that according to free market theories shouldn't even have existed in the first place." Just to clarify Milton Friedman (A champion of free market economics) readily acknowledges racism. His argument is more along the lines of "in the long term racist businesses wil…

Even the kindest reading of that sort of ideology is saying that rather than solve the problem now, we'll let it solve itself really, really slowly.

It's sort of cute in the abstract, but it ignores the reality of people suffering now.

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#28

Post by rayiner »

jsonne wrote: post #17
rayiner wrote: post #7

There's a really simple explanatory mechanism, which is that even if an AirBnB host is bound by the same anti-discrimination provisions of the Civil Rights Act as a Hyatt, which is probably true, holding individual service providers accountable at that level is basically impossible. And to the extent that the "sharing economy" involves more individuals rather than businesses that can be sued, you will see more discri…

"The elimination of overt racial discrimination in private businesses is actually a wonderful example of concerted government action addressing a problem that according to free market theories shouldn't even have existed in the first place." Just to clarify Milton Friedman (A champion of free market economics) readily acknowledges racism. His argument is more along the lines of "in the long term racist businesses wil…

I like Friedman, but this is one of his more hand-wavey arguments. It ignores the fact that discrimination might be a positive marketing characteristic for a business. If the customers are themselves racist, a business might lose a lot more revenue by serving minority customers than it gains from those customers. Indeed, even if all the business owners are not racist, as long as most of the customers are, they face a collective action problem. The first business to serve minority customers would quickly lose most of its customers to the competing businesses. And that seems to be precisely what was happening in the U.S. until Congress broke the cycle by making such discrimination illegal.

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#29

Post by wyager »

cllns wrote: post #19

White supremacy is an oppressive institution that reaches throughout all of society. Unless it is actively fought against, it will prevail.

>White Supremacy is an oppressive institution that reaches throughout all of society. Unless it is actively fought against, it will prevail.

Or, you know, we could just educate people and get rid of racism in a way that doesn't swap one bad thing for another (like racist policies intended to favor non-whites, which I assume you're referring to).

Re: Is the shared economy racist?

#30

Post by learc83 »

This isn't limited to white hosts either. My brother stayed with a black couple during an internship in DC last summer (he's white).

They told him that after several bad experiences they no longer host black guests.

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