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John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

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Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#11

Post by ams6110 »

wozniacki wrote: post #5

I know that Business Insider is practically detested in these parts, but the piece linked here neatly summarizes - with line charts - the misguided dietary trends in the U.S., that have led to the high prevalence of chronic conditions like obesity and diabetes and the general state of poor health and thereby, soaring medical costs. http://www.businessinsider.com/whats-wrong-with-the-modern-d...

And yet we still keep thinking the government has the answers to health care. The FDA promoted most of these trends.

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#12

Post by eliben »

Interesting to see this, having just finished one of Gary Taubes' books and reading another. Especially "Good Calories, Bad Calories" is an extremely well-researched work talking exactly about the issues discussed in this article, presenting countless researches and scientific facts related to it.

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#13

Post by Jun8 »

As they say: "The dose makes the poison". Stating that sugar is toxic, as Lustig and others do, (see his talk on YouTube or http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/17/magazine/mag-17Sugar-t.htm...) to me does not make much sense in fighting against the super high levels of consumption: When you argue a position that's too far removed from most people's accepted positions, they tend to tune you out. Note that high-fructose corn syrup (water+glucose+fructose) is included in this generalized definition of "sugar", which, of course nobody would add to their coffee or tea (that would be sucrose or table sugar), but is now used ubiquitously in the food industry (http://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/edible-innovatio...). A better option would be to single HFCS out and fight against its use.

While reading this the following question came to mind: If Yudkin's results were so groundbreaking and well backed up, why was he kind of shut off from the academic community. Stating that the "sugar lobby" ended his career sounds a bit too far fetched.

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#15

Post by CEyzaguirre »

ams6110 wrote: post #11
wozniacki wrote: post #5

I know that Business Insider is practically detested in these parts, but the piece linked here neatly summarizes - with line charts - the misguided dietary trends in the U.S., that have led to the high prevalence of chronic conditions like obesity and diabetes and the general state of poor health and thereby, soaring medical costs. http://www.businessinsider.com/whats-wrong-with-the-modern-d...

And yet we still keep thinking the government has the answers to health care. The FDA promoted most of these trends.

And yet others have such faith in the market behind such regulatory capture.

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#16

Post by rosser »

sjtrny wrote: post #8

It's not as simple as "sugar is poison". Some form of "sugar" is in virtually everything we eat. It is unavoidable. Just stick to the rule of "Eat food, not too much, mostly plants" and quit screaming about sugar.

Interestingly enough, the very source of that quote goes on to make a bright-line distinction between food and food products, which, not coincidentally, are chief on the "sugar is poison" crowd's "avoid" list.

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#17

Post by spindritf »

Jun8 wrote: post #13

As they say: "The dose makes the poison". Stating that sugar is toxic, as Lustig and others do, (see his talk on YouTube or http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/17/magazine/mag-17Sugar-t.htm... ) to me does not make much sense in fighting against the super high levels of consumption: When you argue a position that's too far removed from most people's accepted positions, they tend to tune you out. Note that high-fructose co…

Note that high-fructose corn syrup (water+glucose+fructose) is included in this generalized definition of "sugar"

I cannot imagine a narrower definition of "sugar" than glucose+fructose. It's exactly what you add to your coffee and tea, just in the form of sucrose crystals.

There is no functional difference between HFCS and table sugar. If the regulators/activists force the food industry to replace HFCS with some other sugar, all they'll achieve is a minor increase in prices.

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#18

Post by pvnick »

I'm getting sick of this ignorant sugar alarmism. Sugar is not the culprit behind all the diseases listed in the article. Obesity is [5] [6]. Unless of course you're talking about cavities. Then not brushing your teeth is the culprit. The reason sugar gets such a bad rep is that high-sugar foods tend to be less-filling and lead to overeating [1]. Stay at a healthy weight by controlling caloric consumption [2].

The article mentions such scientific evidence as "nearly two-thirds of the studies cited there to repudiate Lustig's views were funded by Coca-Cola." Seriously?

Normally I wouldn't care - sugar alarmism = more candy for me - except that, as the article notes, "Lustig ... calls for sugar to be treated as a toxin, like alcohol and tobacco, and for sugar-laden foods to be taxed, labelled with health warnings and banned for anyone under 18." That's just bullshit extremism. Doughnuts, one of my favorite foods, can be part of a healthy diet just like anything else. In fact, sugar is fantastic for stimulating muscle growth [3], and can help with diet adherence during a caloric deficit [4].

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin_index - this page lists satiety indexes for common foods. Notice all the lowest scores are bakery goods and sugary snacks.

[2] http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/early/2009/10/14/ajcn.2009...

[3] http://jcs.biologists.org/content/122/20/3589.full

[4] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11126336?ordinalpos=47&it...

[5] http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/health-topics/topics/obe/ris...

[6] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19801534

Edit: People are taking my words out of context. This is my reply to another comment below that elucidates my meaning: "I advocate moderation and balance. Consume reasonable calorie and macronutrient (protein, fat, carbohydrate) quantities. Eat what allows you to do that. For me, those carbs come from doughnuts and candy but also from brown rice and pasta. Just like my meats include both lean meats (chicken breast) and fatty, delicious meats (bacon). Combine this with exercise and all you'll avoid all the scary things the article talks about."

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#19

Post by jimeuxx »

Lustig could no doubt write some great posts here about growth hacking and selling your product, but if there's one thing he's proven about nutrition, it's that he's no one to be taken seriously when talking about it. One taste of what Joe Public doesn't see in his unintended hyperbole is here: http://sweetenerstudies.com/sites/default/files/resources/fi...

Blaming sugar for everything is no better than what the fat-bashing crowd do. It leads to self-parodying solutions like the "keto-adapted" lifestyle. We don't eat rice or bananas because refined sugar is to blame for all the ills of the world. Those crazy Japanese are probably just lying about their lack of heart disease anyway (when we remember the place exists at all).

As long as people only understand nutrition in terms of reductionist extremes, "alternative" diets are going to continue being a bad joke that achieves little more than inflating the ego and bank balance of people like Lustig.

Re: John Yudkin: the man who tried to warn us about sugar

#20

Post by sillysaurus2 »

pvnick wrote: post #18

I'm getting sick of this ignorant sugar alarmism. Sugar is not the culprit behind all the diseases listed in the article. Obesity is [5] [6]. Unless of course you're talking about cavities. Then not brushing your teeth is the culprit. The reason sugar gets such a bad rep is that high-sugar foods tend to be less-filling and lead to overeating [1]. Stay at a healthy weight by controlling caloric consumption [2]. The ar…

Doughnuts, one of my favorite foods, can be part of a healthy diet

Can they?

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