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Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

coindesk.com

171–180 of 218 posts

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#171
post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hang on. Isn't that just a matter of someone setting up a market and contracts for it? What you mean is that no one has setup bitcoins margins market yet right? Or am I misunderstanding something fundamental about BTC that prevents margins?

You can trade contracts for difference (CFDs) on Bitcoin with 1:10 leverage, including shorting them, at places like Plus500 Great way of taking the risk created with the volatility of Bitcoin and multiplying up the risk massively so you can lose money even faster...

I know I'm risk averse, but even still this seems like the basest insanity to me.

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#172
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also worth noting is the fact that the Bitcoin Price Index has been massively resilient to all the bad "news" thats been pouring in this month. It has been consistently hovering around the 670-700 mark.

part of the reason is that bit coin does not depend on any banks if you have 100 btc in an offline wallet, you will still have it tomorrow, despite whatever bugs/attacks hit the exchanges. imagine if your bank was hacked, many people would literally be removed of their money. With cryptocoins, you have the advantages of keeping dollars under your mattress while still bring able to spend them anywhere that accepts the…

> imagine if your bank was hacked, many people would literally be removed of their money.

Are you sure about that? For the most part those transactions would simply be reversed. Bitcoin exchanges seem a lot more exposed to computer security breaches to me.

> With cryptocoins, you have the advantages of keeping dollars under your mattress while still bring able to spend them anywhere that accepts them.

Paper currency is a bearer instrument. It can be used for offline payments. Cryptocoin can't be. Both parties need to be connected to the rest of the coin network so the transfer can confirmed by other nodes.

Not to say that cryptocoins have no under-the-matress advantages. They are a lot easier to hide than cash and you can make backup copies of them, which obviously can't be done with cash.

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#173
post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another narrative goes as follows: The world's major governments unlinked their currencies from gold because it proved inconvenient for their regressive redistribution activities - cronyism, military-industrial complex, propping up the banking system, etc (not saying it's a conspiracy, just a natural consequence of authoritarianism). Note that the US unlinked in 1970 and the last year that the GINI coefficient improv…

> Note that the US unlinked in 1970 and the last year that the GINI coefficient improved was 1973. FDR temporarily unlinked in 1933 and we had the great depression [1]. The U.S. domestic economy unlinked in 1933, permanently. Only international trade continued to use gold-backed currency, and it is that aspect which was finally eliminated in 1973. Likewise you have mixed up your cause/effect for the Great Depression,…

> The U.S. domestic economy unlinked in 1933, permanently. Only international trade continued to use gold-backed currency, and it is that aspect which was finally eliminated in 1973.

If the iternational market for dollars is still linked, in spite of domestic unlinkage, there is still some level of grounding, because of the possibility of commodity arbitrage (both directly and indirectly). Certainly there was inflation during that era, and the dollar slipped so far that it led to Nixon's actions... But for the most part the standard of living was able to keep up, largely thanks to technological and infrastructural improvements. Moreover, you couldn't soak the bankers/financial sector quite as easily because of the international connection to gold (and international currency arbitrage is more important to bankers and finance than your average domestic schmoe).

> Likewise you have mixed up your cause/effect for the Great Depression

Sorry, I should have said, I believe if we hadn't unlinked it we would have only had a shorter, not-so-great depression (emphasis on great, not on depression). Obviously, I'm aware that the unlinking came after the stock market crash of 29.

> Holding currency to a gold standard by some fixed price would be called "price control" in any other context, and we already know price controls to be bad policy.

No, price controls are setting the price relative to a standard that's backed up by guns (guns = "control", as in, if you don't do what I say I can shoot you, or point a gun at you and take you to jail). Dollars are already backed up by guns, so the notion of 'price controlling' dollars makes no sense. If anything, you want to back dollars by gold to keep the people with guns honest.

The dollar is already an 'amarket' entity by virtue of its backing by the state. A better example of 'letting the market decide' in the context of 'valuing currency' would be letting the interest rate float, without manipulation, which is also something we most certainly don't do.

>The biggest irony for me with regard to Bitcoin is that it proves the fiat concept.

There are goldbugs who insist that Bitcoin is silly because it's not tied to anything with 'intrinsic value'. That's one interpretation of the fiat concept. But I (and many others) interpret fiat to mean 'by a higher power' (by analogy to fiat lux) except in the general case of state currencies, the higher power being the authority of the state.

Indeed a gold-backed dollar is still a fiat currency, albeit a more responsible one.

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#174
post #40
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also worth noting is the fact that the Bitcoin Price Index has been massively resilient to all the bad "news" thats been pouring in this month. It has been consistently hovering around the 670-700 mark.

I can't find the article now, but there have been several good articles explaining the lack of gravity on bitcoin in general. Basically, the price goes up quickly when new people are attracted to bitcoin and rush to buy. When the price dips however, because so much is bought for long term speculation, the price doesn't really dip much, as no one is incentivised to sell and hold out for when it gets better. At some po…

> If a crash happens it'll probably happen before people realise it, but suddenly there just won't be anyone wanting to buy coins anymore.

Not sure how true this is. Bitcoin has been going through a few major crashes in the past 3 years, yet the demand was still strong after it went down.

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#175
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't find the article now, but there have been several good articles explaining the lack of gravity on bitcoin in general. Basically, the price goes up quickly when new people are attracted to bitcoin and rush to buy. When the price dips however, because so much is bought for long term speculation, the price doesn't really dip much, as no one is incentivised to sell and hold out for when it gets better. At some po…

Sounds like the reason they gave for why houses always goes up.

You should know bitbugs don't like history.

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is why we buy gold and silver.

Isn't the commission too expensive?

No. You can usually buy physical at spot + 1 or 2% max. In the UK, coins like Sovereigns or Britannias are capital gains tax free, so you typically pay a bit more for them, like 4 or 5% above spot. But then you won't have the headache of remembering what you bought them for when you sell them (aside from the pleasure of saving CGT-free).

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is why we buy gold and silver.

Isn't the commission too expensive?

Worth it for long term storage like that.

These days spending old banknotes is problematic, even if they're in perfect condition.

Some people love gold, some people hate it, but everyone agrees it's the only thing that really has zero counterparty risk.

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is why we buy gold and silver.

Isn't the commission too expensive?

let's say the trade commission was a horrifying 50%, and in the best case scenario for the other direction the treasury exchanged those bills exactly one for one. Would you rather have $1000 or gold from 50 years ago valued at $500 from 50 years ago? Even if you think gold is in a bubble, and, say worth $200/oz instead of $1600/oz, you would have far more than 5 oz worth from 500 1963 dollars.

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#179
post #36
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enjoyment. Some people just like to watch the world burn.

That's a very quotable statement, and it is indeed true -- some people are intelligent and sociopathic enough that they care about their own amusement more than anything else. But sadism is very rare, in reality. Most robbers don't give the rubies they steal to the village children. Most galloping animals with four hooves are horses, not zebras.

> But sadism is very rare, in reality.

But the power of the internet can magnify the effect of a single sadist to the point that it affects a million people (up to the limited extent that such opportunities exist).

Re: Bitcoin Exchanges Under ‘Massive and Concerted Attack’

#180
post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the commission too expensive?

Worth it for long term storage like that. These days spending old banknotes is problematic, even if they're in perfect condition. Some people love gold, some people hate it, but everyone agrees it's the only thing that really has zero counterparty risk.

I wouldn't say zero! Also, moving forward things like planetary resources could challenge the stability of gold, but it's still pretty good and fairly liquid. For me, it proved more liquid than bitcoin; Exchanging bitcoin took 3 days coinbase + ACH; I liquidated a gold piece in an afternoon, could have gotten cash, but mailed a check into my bank and had the funds in 2 days (still faster than bitcoin, even with the USPS in the way)
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