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Facebook Fraud [video]

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Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#301

Post by jokoon »

thisiswrong wrote: post #146
jokoon wrote: post #118

This makes me hate the web. I like the internet, but facebook infested so many websites with those widgets... If facebook keeps living, I'll say "meeeh". If it goes down, I'll say "GREAT. Now's the chance for reddit and twitter and G+ and others".

> If it goes down, I'll say "GREAT. Now's the chance for reddit and twitter and G+ and others". You cheer on centralized corporate systems that have business models based on censorship, vote manipulations, surveillance, arbitrary policy changes, and spam. While you cheer them on, I will be saying now's the chance for democratic distributed blockchain based replacements for the Twitters, Gmails, and Facebooks. Think B…

Well, then make a startup and do it. But I still think facebook has to die first. Google+ and other are just imitating facebook to introduce some competition.

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#302

Post by tripzilch »

xxbondsxx wrote: post #179
notlisted wrote: post #26

Nice video. All true. I have performed tests with the same ad budget ($20k) and target audience for Google and FB. FB ROI was negative. Google ROI was 400% (travel space). The only thing that seemingly "works" has been buying likes by advertising. This video should help educate my clients of the utter uselessness of those too. This brings up the interesting question of the general (non)value of a lot of mobile advert…

Hey everyone -- sorry to hijack the top thread but I’m an ads engineer at Facebook so I feel qualified to respond. I posted this over on reddit too but it's still pending approval. In the case of this ad — I think we actually delivered on what was asked for. The targeting specs were fairly broad (cat lovers in four countries). Getting 39 people who like cats to like a page with a cute cat picture in 20 minutes sounds…

> I’m an ads engineer at Facebook so I feel qualified to respond.

You'll be qualified to respond when you've actually watched the video so you won't have to write uninformed drivel like the following:

> In the case of this ad — I think we actually delivered on what was asked for. The targeting specs were fairly broad (cat lovers in four countries). Getting 39 people who like cats to like a page with a cute cat picture in 20 minutes sounds pretty reasonable to me.

Because that is exactly what did not happen in the video.

> Fake (and low quality) likes are bad for everyone.

Nobody was talking about "low quality" likes, the topic under discussion is fake ones, from fake accounts by fake people.

> We don’t want advertisers to get fans that aren’t good for their business -- we want to help them drive real results, and we can’t do that with bad likes. We invest a lot in improving the systems to monitor and remove fake likes from the system, and also in helping advertisers set smart targeting to help them reach the people they care most about.

Blablabla, said every advertiser, ever.

> And to be honest, a lot of people like cats, and the picture on the page is pretty adorable. Lots of real people like lots of things. And LOTS of people like cats.

Once again, did you not watch the video, or are you in fact arguing that those 39 people are actually real people and not fake accounts?

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#303

Post by tripzilch »

theli0nheart wrote: post #188
xxbondsxx wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey everyone -- sorry to hijack the top thread but I’m an ads engineer at Facebook so I feel qualified to respond. I posted this over on reddit too but it's still pending approval. In the case of this ad — I think we actually delivered on what was asked for. The targeting specs were fairly broad (cat lovers in four countries). Getting 39 people who like cats to like a page with a cute cat picture in 20 minutes sounds…

It's not just paid likes that people are worrying about--it's organic likes too...which brings me to my question. What is your response to the other problem the OP references: spammers liking thousands of unrelated pages to confuse your algorithms, which in turn diminishes audience reach across the entire network? I guess I just don't understand why the responsibility is on the advertiser to "target the right people.…

> If I had a Page that I wanted to target in Bangladesh, how exactly could I go about doing that without having the majority of my likes be fake?

Well obviously this means you can't use targeted advertising on people in Bangladesh.

Hm. We should roll out click farms everywhere.

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#304

Post by hayksaakian »

haffi112 wrote: post #298
hayksaakian wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it was mentioned in the video, doing this creates a negative effect. the video mentioned how real/useful engagement didn't change before and after he got all those fake likes

I meant likes on particular posts on the page. Not the page itself.

Precisely.

According to the video, the click farmers will like the page itself, but not any content it posts.

If your page likes are mostly fake, your posts likes will be proportionately lower.

The auther discovered that Facebook tests your posts among your following, and uses the % that liked the post as a signal as to whether it should show it to the rest of your network.

Now, if you are paying farmers for likes, they might also be liking the content you post. If you're not paying for likes at all, but you have a bunch of fake likes on your page, your posts will get proportionately fewer likes, and FB will show your post to fewer people.

The point was ultimately:

By buying likes, legitimately or not, your page will attract likes from fake accounts -- Which due to the aforementioned reasons will tank the presence of your page in the news feed of real users.

The only workaround from this position is to promote your posts either through legitimate or illegitimate means.

The other byproduct of this notion is that using the free coupons that Facebook tends to offer can cause more damage than they are supposedly supposed to fix.

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#305

Post by batiudrami »

alb000 wrote: post #294
batiudrami wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If deleting your Facebook would not have a negative affect on your real life social life, you are not using it the way most people do. Almost every organised event that I go to starts with a Facebook invite, or someone sharing the event on their feed. It's also a massive time waster, but until another event service gains actual adoption (a service such as this is useless without users, right?), I'll keep using Facebo…

If your life relies on Facebook, then you have to social life and no friends ad all, you just have an illusion. If no one would call you for an event,what does this say about you?

It really only says that my friends are lazy. You could equally say the same thing with a mobile phone - if your friend would not send a paper invite, what does that say about you?

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#306

Post by baby »

euphemize wrote: post #126
baby wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish I could do that. I used to ask a friend to change my password, now I use www.offsocialnetwork.com to do it (I'm doing it this week). But I can't go really long without facebook since all is planned from there, the parties, the social events, the foreign friends visiting my city, foreign friends keeping in touch with me... I guess it's easier not to have facebook when you didn't travel a lot and don't ha…

It's actually very easy to have a booming social life and travel tons without Facebook.

if you want to share your secrets I'm all ears.

For example, last year I got to meet maybe 30 friends from all over the world because they were passing through France or wanted to go travel to the country I was traveling to. I wouldn't have met them if they didn't have my facebook as I rarely keep touch with people far from me (before facebook). My mail is filled with spam and I change my number every year.

I also moved to a new city, didn't know anyone, joined the erasmus group and a few weeks after I knew 100+ people, was getting invited to parties every day, was meeting new people every day.

You can always try to avoid facebook, it will be more difficult though.

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#307

Post by pawelwentpawel »

dmazin wrote: post #192
xxbondsxx wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey everyone -- sorry to hijack the top thread but I’m an ads engineer at Facebook so I feel qualified to respond. I posted this over on reddit too but it's still pending approval. In the case of this ad — I think we actually delivered on what was asked for. The targeting specs were fairly broad (cat lovers in four countries). Getting 39 people who like cats to like a page with a cute cat picture in 20 minutes sounds…

I do not think you addressed the actual point of the video: the clicks on his cat page came from click farms. They were not real people.

Not necessarily all of the fake likes are always from fake accounts. I have witnessed some of my facebook friends 'liking' a big number of pages without their consent, automatically. Most probably as a result of phishing they became a part of some big click farms.

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#308

Post by interstitial »

prostoalex wrote: post #183
Loughla wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"But I can't go really long without facebook since all is planned from there, the parties, the social events, the foreign friends visiting my city, foreign friends keeping in touch with me..." I have two questions to respond to this - how did people do all of these things before the facebook platform? What is stopping you from doing these same things? I find it fascinating that people treat websites like facebook lik…

> I have two questions to respond to this - how did people do all of these things before the facebook platform? What is stopping you from doing these same things? Some of "these things" did not exist before. Like yesterday a former coworker of mine posted a bunch of pictures of her kids growing up, it was interesting and reminded me how the time flies. Would I ask around acquaintances for her phone number, then get o…

Jesus H. Christ, watch some old TV shows and movies. How would one see coworkers kid's photos before facebook!?! They'd pull them out of their wallet or purse, an album on the coffee table. It was a cliche and staple of sitcoms to be annoyed by the endless stream of kid photos from a wallet.

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#309

Post by interstitial »

0x0 wrote: post #43
JacobJans wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that he's intentionally buying likes from people he KNOWS aren't responsive. The simple solution? Stop targetting the unresponsive countries. It's not rocket science. It's actually super-brain-dead obvious. If you're buying likes from India -- and no Indians are responding to your content -- then why would you keep buying likes from India? This is stuff you can spend $5 to figure out. It is very, very,…

He was buying likes only from the US and he was still getting fraudulent likes from profiles that liked thousands of pages.

It's funny how he predicted all these stock objections to his claims of fraud in the video, and yet they all appear here in the HN thread. Let's all watch the video again shall we?

Re: Facebook Fraud [video]

#310

Post by bauc »

AznHisoka wrote: post #85
dangrossman wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've run many profitable campaigns on Facebook -- by not buying likes or advertising a Facebook Page. You can advertise normal links on Facebook and that operates like any other online ad -- some text and a picture, linked to a landing page for your own site. There's no "likes" to count or "engagement" to measure other than the normal conversion metrics -- how many of the clickthroughs completed whatever action you w…

Sounds like that's the only viable way to have profitable campaigns: having ads that go directly to your landing page. I for one am confused as to why people chose the other indirect, convoluted way: buying likes, directing people to their FB page, THEN hoping they click through to their actual website.

You can save money on a Facebook ad by linking to a Facebook page, well on a per click basis but I'm not sure if it's a good strategy overall.
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