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Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

nature.com

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Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#21

Post by reidrubsamen »

frisco wrote: post #4

Just to clarify, I followed up "you can have people who are bad at science but are good at fundraising in public," with "and you can have people with very good science who are bad at fundraising," and I think you probably have a lot more of the latter than the former, which I perceive as the larger injustice. I didn't mean to come across as a downer on the project. I was clear to point out that I know very little abo…

We as physician scientists never really learned how to communicate science broadly to the public - I think our open science approach, which will bring people close to what we are doing in the lab, is the best way to go! This is a learning process for us and I appreciate your support!

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#22

Post by dnautics »

Fomite wrote: post #18
dnautics wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey! You gave some great examples! Go to meetings. Talk to them. Send them emails asking about their work. Observe experimental design and data collection (if that's not public, that should be part of your judgement). Read non-publication sources (patents, regulatory submissions). And then yes, do squishy stuff like "judge their character", "talk to their postdocs", "ask around about professional opinions". It's a co…

I've read their white paper, it too is short on details. Right now, their experimental design and data collection aren't public. I go to meetings - I saw nothing about them at the largest infectious disease conference of the year this year. I'm really not conflating anything. I'm very skeptical of any project getting this much attention that doesn't have some papers published. It's not the only step, but it's a step,…

As an example: Salk didn't publish much before getting funded to work on the polio vaccine.

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#23

Post by Fomite »

Fomite wrote: post #18
dnautics wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey! You gave some great examples! Go to meetings. Talk to them. Send them emails asking about their work. Observe experimental design and data collection (if that's not public, that should be part of your judgement). Read non-publication sources (patents, regulatory submissions). And then yes, do squishy stuff like "judge their character", "talk to their postdocs", "ask around about professional opinions". It's a co…

I've read their white paper, it too is short on details. Right now, their experimental design and data collection aren't public. I go to meetings - I saw nothing about them at the largest infectious disease conference of the year this year. I'm really not conflating anything. I'm very skeptical of any project getting this much attention that doesn't have some papers published. It's not the only step, but it's a step,…

And like I said, if these guys turn out to be Salk, I'll happily eat my hat.

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#24

Post by Fomite »

reidrubsamen wrote: post #19
Fomite wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't view it as a hit piece, because that's not the author talking. And while I don't necessarily agree with it, I do think that they're long on "Crowdfunded free HIV vaccine" and short on specifics. And I'd still be pleased as punch if it worked.

Hi! This is Reid, CEO of immunity project. Thanks for your comments! Our previous work is under review by a PRJ - our crowd funding is allowing us to do additional work which we will try to publish as quickly as possible! We have our white paper on our web site - if you want to discuss more details please shoot us an email at team@ImmunityProject.org

Thanks for the reply - I know my comments sound a little harsh, but I really am rooting for you guys.

I read over the white paper, but honestly, my expertise is way down the road from where you guys are right now.

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#25

Post by icinnamon »

reidrubsamen wrote: post #19
Fomite wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't view it as a hit piece, because that's not the author talking. And while I don't necessarily agree with it, I do think that they're long on "Crowdfunded free HIV vaccine" and short on specifics. And I'd still be pleased as punch if it worked.

Hi! This is Reid, CEO of immunity project. Thanks for your comments! Our previous work is under review by a PRJ - our crowd funding is allowing us to do additional work which we will try to publish as quickly as possible! We have our white paper on our web site - if you want to discuss more details please shoot us an email at team@ImmunityProject.org

Ian from Immunity Project here. Here's a link to our White Paper, as well: http://www.immunityproject.org/documents/Immunity_Project_Wh...

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#26

Post by dnautics »

reidrubsamen wrote: post #21
frisco wrote: post #4

Just to clarify, I followed up "you can have people who are bad at science but are good at fundraising in public," with "and you can have people with very good science who are bad at fundraising," and I think you probably have a lot more of the latter than the former, which I perceive as the larger injustice. I didn't mean to come across as a downer on the project. I was clear to point out that I know very little abo…

We as physician scientists never really learned how to communicate science broadly to the public - I think our open science approach, which will bring people close to what we are doing in the lab, is the best way to go! This is a learning process for us and I appreciate your support!

what tools are you using to communicate your results to the public? Will your data be available in real-time (or near-real-time)?

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#27

Post by reidrubsamen »

TrainedMonkey wrote: post #2

Sometimes when it sounds too good to be true... Are there any real researches behind this project?

Thanks for your comments! We have a great team with a lot of experience in computer science, drug delivery and HIV-relevant lab immunology. I studied biochemistry and computer science at UC Berkeley - then going to Stanford for an MD and MS in Computer Science - was in the PhD program in course 6-2 at MIT - left (without getting the PhD) to start Aradigm in Hayward where I worked for 10 years on inhaled insulin.

That was a complex project that required a lot of special technology, much of which we developed ourselves, to make and characterize micro-particles.

CV Herst, Pete Lloyd and I (all part of the Aradigm founding team) have been working together at Immunity Project since the beginning - Pete is an ME (UC Berkeley and Davis) who built and operates our precision spray drying system for sphere manufacturing. CV got his MPH at Berkeley in Med Micro and his PhD from North Western in Mo Bio later doing a post doc at MD Anderson. He has extensive experience working with HIV in both the diagnostic and lab research setting requiring handling the virus in cell culture.

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#28

Post by reidrubsamen »

dnautics wrote: post #26
reidrubsamen wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We as physician scientists never really learned how to communicate science broadly to the public - I think our open science approach, which will bring people close to what we are doing in the lab, is the best way to go! This is a learning process for us and I appreciate your support!

what tools are you using to communicate your results to the public? Will your data be available in real-time (or near-real-time)?

We are setting up an open science web site within the next few weeks that will update people on the project on a regular basis. We are exploring options for rapid publication including ways to post our work during the review process. If you have any ideas here, please let us know using team@immunityproject.org

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#29

Post by Fomite »

nickthemagicman wrote: post #17
dnautics wrote: post #11

I think this is a total hit piece. "They’re preying on people who are desperate for a vaccine," As a contributor (and a scientist) - I don't feel like I've been preyed upon, at all.

This is the way science should be funded. Imagine if the pace of medical research moved at the pace of javascript frameworks. We would all be fucking immortal. There would probably be some mutants though. But you gotta crack some eggs.

"Fail fast, fail often" is less of a good thing when it's actual people's lives.

Re: Crowd-funded HIV vaccine project sparks debate

#30

Post by gregcrv »

dnautics wrote: post #11

I think this is a total hit piece. "They’re preying on people who are desperate for a vaccine," As a contributor (and a scientist) - I don't feel like I've been preyed upon, at all.

Yes, and I prefer many "desperate" healthy people choosing to give little money to fund alternative researches (even if sometimes it fails) than big pharmaceutical companies bankrupting "desperate" ill patients (and families) for a cure that's not guaranty to save them. Reading this http://priceonomics.com/the-rapidly-escalating-price-of-canc... makes me think that drug industry is broken.
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