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Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

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31–40 of 78 posts

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#31

"Morfit is a 37-year-old activist investor whose employer, the private hedge fund ValueAct, acquired a 0.8 percent stake in Microsoft in August. That was enough to put Morfit on the board." Slightly OT, but how does owning < 1% of a company's shares qualify for a board seat? Can someone who knows about these things enlighten me?

> Slightly OT, but how does owning That's easy to explain:

1. Corporate boards should show a fair representation of the largest stockholders.

2. For a board with 100 members, it should be apparent that anyone with more than 1% of the corporation's stock must be given a place on the board. But this only makes a point and isn't a typical board -- 100 members is unwieldy.

3. Another case is one in which the majority of the corporation stock is held by many small investors and there are only a few majority stockholders. In this case, someone holding more than an individual investor but less than the majority investors may still earn a place, even on a relatively small board.

4. Another way to describe this is to take the number of board seats and distribute them among those individuals who hold the largest stock holdings, in declining order. For example, let's say there are ten board positions, five majority stockholders and a pool of smaller investors with quickly declining stock percentages. In this case, a stockholder with a very small stake might acquire a position on the board simply by being counted among the ten largest stockholders.

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#32
post #11
post #7

Wait, they what? Bing and Surface I can understand to a degree, but they want Microsoft to kill Xbox, one of their strongest brands, and one of Microsoft's only hopes for differentiation? For what, to chase the smartphone game or something?

Considering just how big of a financial black hole Xbox has been throughout the years, it's not surprising. Some sources say the 360 lost about 3 billion[1] while others that it lost 2.5 billion PER year[2]. The Xbone lost about 1 billion dollars so far (was expected to lose 2)[3] And it's not just Microsoft that is losing money on these consoles, Sony is in the read as well. [4] [1]: http://www.neowin.net/news/repor…

Why should MS invest in hardware, when PC's offer better hardware, run the windows store to share profit with MS and have good enough DRM(as steam shows, and might even be improved by working with pc manufacturers) ?

Most likely in the future, MS will do something similar to steam - just sell software for so called "consoles", and have hardware partners. That will help with the losses issues.

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#33
post #4

Listen, I'm no fan of Microsoft, but those investors better keep their hands of the ergonomic keyboard product line, or I'll... I'll... probably have to stockpile them? Seriously though, the ergo 4000 is the best keyboard I've ever owned and I'd hate to see it gone by the hand of somebody who just doesn't care enough.

Potential Stockpiler of the 4000 here as well. We should form an interest and alert group for the day when it becomes reality... :)

The point of stockpiling is that you do it before scarcity sets in.

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#34

Well Microsoft got XBOX wrong two times in a row. So no surprises here. Only the first XBOX was good console IMO. XBone and 360 were disappointments [1]. Surface is also one of the products Microsoft almost got right - there was real interest on windows on ARM at the time. But full windows. And Bing - well its only advantage over google is the turned off content filter. [1] Owned 360 for 5 years, played 5 hours on it…

> [1] Owned 360 for 5 years, played 5 hours on it.

so because YOU only played 5 hours on YOUR 360, the console was a failure?

Let me counter your anecdote with one of my own: The XBOX was a disappointment and the 360 was a good console. Reason: I played much more on my 360 than the original.

The 360 was around for a much longer time than the original and there were many more games made for the 360 than for the original.

If you don't believe that to be enough, there were 24M original xboxes sold, compared to 80M xbox 360.

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ORLY? References / sources?

OS X. Now free

That's completely different. OS X is not really free, the same way iOS is not free. It just comes bundled with the hardware and you get updates till the EOL of the product.

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#36

"Morfit is a 37-year-old activist investor whose employer, the private hedge fund ValueAct, acquired a 0.8 percent stake in Microsoft in August. That was enough to put Morfit on the board." Slightly OT, but how does owning < 1% of a company's shares qualify for a board seat? Can someone who knows about these things enlighten me?

At 300 billion market cap .8% = 2.4 billion investment. It seems ValueAct demanded changes from the management and they could argue they represent the vision of also other (activist) shareholders.

Read this article for details: http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB1000142412788732332490...

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#37
post #20

One word: Idiots. Seriously, those investors are morons. MS has never been a a company that fits the adjective: "lean". MS is practically a post-secondary institution unto itself! MS' far-reaching speculative research is the stuff of legend, and far too infrequently translated into the commercial sphere. Anyone who thinks they should narrow their focus and ignore more of the fruits of their labor instead of less is a…

Microsoft has never made a profit with Xbox. In fact, they've only lost billions of dollars on it, and the chance to recover them isactually smaller than it was for Xbox 360, not just because I think Sony has a stronger showing this time around (and at a lower price to boot), but because I don't think the new consoles have a life bigger than 5 years in them.

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#38
post #32
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering just how big of a financial black hole Xbox has been throughout the years, it's not surprising. Some sources say the 360 lost about 3 billion[1] while others that it lost 2.5 billion PER year[2]. The Xbone lost about 1 billion dollars so far (was expected to lose 2)[3] And it's not just Microsoft that is losing money on these consoles, Sony is in the read as well. [4] [1]: http://www.neowin.net/news/repor…

Why should MS invest in hardware, when PC's offer better hardware, run the windows store to share profit with MS and have good enough DRM(as steam shows, and might even be improved by working with pc manufacturers) ? Most likely in the future, MS will do something similar to steam - just sell software for so called "consoles", and have hardware partners. That will help with the losses issues.

I think there's a case for MS to make hardware either to show what top notch PC kit looks like or a cheap minimum to stop OEMs pumping out worse than that.

MS don't need to make the consumer device everyone has they just have to force OEMs to not make piles of crap. In a way I think intel kind of own how well MS can perform with hardware. If they didn't push utlrabooks I don't know if we would have gotten anything in the pc space as well built as some apple kit.

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#39
post #11
post #7

Wait, they what? Bing and Surface I can understand to a degree, but they want Microsoft to kill Xbox, one of their strongest brands, and one of Microsoft's only hopes for differentiation? For what, to chase the smartphone game or something?

Considering just how big of a financial black hole Xbox has been throughout the years, it's not surprising. Some sources say the 360 lost about 3 billion[1] while others that it lost 2.5 billion PER year[2]. The Xbone lost about 1 billion dollars so far (was expected to lose 2)[3] And it's not just Microsoft that is losing money on these consoles, Sony is in the read as well. [4] [1]: http://www.neowin.net/news/repor…

The $2.5 billion per year figure is of course beyond silly. That'd be $20+ billion, off of 80 million consoles, or $250+ per console (an impossible figure right off the bat; their per unit losses from day one were lower than that).

$3 billion in losses over eight or nine years is irrelevant, literally, to Microsoft's fiscal picture. They have $84 billion in cash, and are compiling another $25 billion every year. Their ability to stay in the game financially, has helped result in the death of Nintendo when it comes to hardware, eliminating a big competitor. Microsoft can fund these losses forever so long as there is a good strategic reason for it (Sony on the other hand cannot).

Re: Investors want Microsoft’s new CEO to kill Xbox, Bing and Surface

#40
post #34

Well Microsoft got XBOX wrong two times in a row. So no surprises here. Only the first XBOX was good console IMO. XBone and 360 were disappointments [1]. Surface is also one of the products Microsoft almost got right - there was real interest on windows on ARM at the time. But full windows. And Bing - well its only advantage over google is the turned off content filter. [1] Owned 360 for 5 years, played 5 hours on it…

> [1] Owned 360 for 5 years, played 5 hours on it. so because YOU only played 5 hours on YOUR 360, the console was a failure? Let me counter your anecdote with one of my own: The XBOX was a disappointment and the 360 was a good console. Reason: I played much more on my 360 than the original. The 360 was around for a much longer time than the original and there were many more games made for the 360 than for the origin…

The run of X360 was almost twice of the Xbox. Correct for that. Also PS2 shipped 150 million units by which metric the whole 7th gen was disappointment because PS3 and X360 managed to ship slightly more combined.

But yes - 360 was a failure. We got stratification of the published, ballooning budgets, total homogenization of the games. Every abusive trick ever from publishers on the consoles, red ring of death, needlessly complicated online survives (the whole MS points crap), XBOX live gold subscriptions and the console barely broke even at best from every report I have ever read. The decision for the HDD to be optional was "brilliant". The first few revisions of the hardware were poorly made. Instead of the ugly but perfectly cool able and boring xbox we got something elegant, pretty, noisy and overheating.

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