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Things Microsoft Still Does Well

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Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#41

Post by nahname »

stinos wrote: post #37
nahname wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Active Directory, SQL Server, Azure, C# and Visual Studio are all amazing What else have you tried? IMO, it is very hard to find anyone that worked on the MS stack, moved to something else and wants to go back to Microsoft.

It's not that hard. For me at least, since as a Visual Studio user I'm definitely a fit answer for your question. For C++ for example I tried XCode, KDevelop, NetBeans, Eclipse just to name some. None of those are bad, some are even good, and at some points maybe even better than VS, but none offers the complete integrated development environment VS gives me. And if I'd had to guess: I'm not alone.

The original list pertained to picking for a company, rather than the unsurprising discovery that a paid IDE is better than free alternatives.

For example, how would you compare SQL Server install to Postgres? Did your team have an easy time integrating with AD? Was the team more productive in C# than Ruby?

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#42

Post by free652 »

stinos wrote: post #37
nahname wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Active Directory, SQL Server, Azure, C# and Visual Studio are all amazing What else have you tried? IMO, it is very hard to find anyone that worked on the MS stack, moved to something else and wants to go back to Microsoft.

It's not that hard. For me at least, since as a Visual Studio user I'm definitely a fit answer for your question. For C++ for example I tried XCode, KDevelop, NetBeans, Eclipse just to name some. None of those are bad, some are even good, and at some points maybe even better than VS, but none offers the complete integrated development environment VS gives me. And if I'd had to guess: I'm not alone.

Out of the box VS 2013 (C# development) sucks comparing to Eclipse (Java development). You need to buy a bunch of plugins for VS, like ReSharper.

I don't know much about C++ though.

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#44

Post by slaman »

asadotzler wrote: post #19

It's time to stop joking about IE like that. IE 11 is a fine Web browser these days. Yes, it took them a while to catch back up, but they have and they're a genuinely modern browser today. Firefox is still a better browser, for a good number of reasons, not the least of which is Mozilla's mission to put users and the health of the Internet first, but Microsoft engineers working on IE for the last few years deserve mo…

I really don't see a multi-billion dollar company finally 'catching up' after years of standards and security abuse worth any praise, and I still find IE's UI to be terrible to use.

I'm glad they're finally starting to take some stress off of me as a developer, but there are still too many people running IE8 and 9 for me to like IE with any sort of passion..

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#45

Post by Svip »

gtirloni wrote: post #38
Svip wrote: post #7

Yes, the Xbox 360 has been a success in the US (beating the PS3), but in every other market than the US, the PS3 has beaten the Xbox 360.[1] And the article in question is very US-centric on that regard. I am not saying the Xbox is necessarily bad, but is it better than the PlayStation? I think that's rather subjective. Although I hear that neither Sony nor Microsoft has made a lot of money from their console adventu…

The table you link to shows Xbox 360 and PS3 with ~80mi each. There around 37mi units not accounted for in the Australia, Canada, Japan, US and Europe. Are you assuming the same trend holds for Latin America then? How does that translate to 'every other market'? In Brazil, Xbox has sold more than PS3 according to the local game industry association. And with the PS4 prices being 2x that of Xbox One, some are predicti…

Wait. I thought the PS4 is $100 cheaper than the Xbox One. I mean the PS4 is cheaper here (Europe) and it is in the US. So I wonder why the PS4 is so much more expensive in Brazil then.

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#46

Post by Svip »

TheCondor wrote: post #40
Svip wrote: post #7

Yes, the Xbox 360 has been a success in the US (beating the PS3), but in every other market than the US, the PS3 has beaten the Xbox 360.[1] And the article in question is very US-centric on that regard. I am not saying the Xbox is necessarily bad, but is it better than the PlayStation? I think that's rather subjective. Although I hear that neither Sony nor Microsoft has made a lot of money from their console adventu…

Not to rile the fanboys but Sony went out late with a more expensive device that had a much more radical and challenging to program architecture and it looks time an awful lot like a tie and far from a victory for either device. That's a win? Don't get me wrong, they are mixing it up but of we are really honest, Nintendo outsold both of them decisively that round. Is that the victory they aimed for and planned on?

I completely agree with the PS3's problems. But I am quite amazed by the fact that despite its higher price tag, its difficulty for programming, etc., the PS3 did rather well. And equally well compared to the Xbox 360. But Sony have learnt the lesson, and thus made the PS4 a far simpler (and cheaper) machine.

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#47

Post by hravnx »

free652 wrote: post #42
stinos wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that hard. For me at least, since as a Visual Studio user I'm definitely a fit answer for your question. For C++ for example I tried XCode, KDevelop, NetBeans, Eclipse just to name some. None of those are bad, some are even good, and at some points maybe even better than VS, but none offers the complete integrated development environment VS gives me. And if I'd had to guess: I'm not alone.

Out of the box VS 2013 (C# development) sucks comparing to Eclipse (Java development). You need to buy a bunch of plugins for VS, like ReSharper. I don't know much about C++ though.

Out-of-the-box VS 2013 (and C# development) is so far ahead of Eclipse (and Java development) that it isn't even the same sport.

The myth that Eclipse users try to perpetuate that "you must buy Resharper just to be able to work in VS" is just that: a myth.

My team has worked on both C# and Java backends for AAA-games and after we moved to C# we have had people actively threatening to resign if we ever went back to Eclipse (and Java). The debugging capabilities, the speed of the tools, the relative sanity of C# compared to Java ... there is simply no comparison.

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#48

Post by marcosdumay »

us0r wrote: post #16
rtfeldman wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep hearing this, but it's just such a foreign concept to me. The idea of - for lack of a better term - surrendering my entire development stack to a single company rings just about every alarm bell in my head. What happens when (say) .NET isn't the best tool for a particular job? Just close your eyes and use the inferior tool anyway? Or use the right tool and just throw the hard-won Microsoft ecosystem synergies…

Look at it from a Fortune 500 perspective (yes obviously exceptions and I'm not saying I agree or disagree). Do we want to run all or part of our business on an open source tool/project which may or may not have a large community around it and may or may not be around tomorrow or do we use the company who is financially committed to X tool and has virtually unlimited money in the bank? This doesn't just apply to Micr…

Sorry, but reality disagrees. Companies with money bet on a solution usually don't last, and communities build around software do last for decades.

.Net itself is the result of Microsoft abandoning (without even an upgrade path) all their previous developers twice, at around 2000 and 2002.

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#49

Post by veidr »

BSousa wrote: post #39
veidr wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Asa is focusing more narrowly than you are. Both arguments are valid. As a browser, MSIE 11 is vastly better than previous versions. They took what was just about the shittiest browser on earth, and made it more or less OK. (Although Firefox and Chrome are both better.) From that limited perspective, kudos to them. As a corporation, though, Microsoft is still a toxic entity with poisonous effects on the ecosy…

And Google isn't? Seriously. They drop products faster than Paris Hilton changes her hair color. They are involved in multi million settlements due to throwing their users privacy rights under a bus. Do you really want a browser from a company that is only interested in violating your privacy for a few extra dollars? Why put MS in the same league as Halliburton but give a free pass to Google? But kudos to Firefox tho…

I didn't say anything about Google.

And, from what I can tell, Paris Hilton's hair color is pretty consistently blond: https://www.google.com/search?q=paris+hilton+hair+color&clie...

Re: Things Microsoft Still Does Well

#50

Post by gtirloni »

Svip wrote: post #45
gtirloni wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The table you link to shows Xbox 360 and PS3 with ~80mi each. There around 37mi units not accounted for in the Australia, Canada, Japan, US and Europe. Are you assuming the same trend holds for Latin America then? How does that translate to 'every other market'? In Brazil, Xbox has sold more than PS3 according to the local game industry association. And with the PS4 prices being 2x that of Xbox One, some are predicti…

Wait. I thought the PS4 is $100 cheaper than the Xbox One. I mean the PS4 is cheaper here (Europe) and it is in the US. So I wonder why the PS4 is so much more expensive in Brazil then.

Import taxes and the fact that Microsoft manufactures locally. Sony took a long time to manufacture the PS2/PS3 here and is repeating the same mistake with the PS4 now. So at release date, Xbox One was R$2100 and PS4 was R$4200.
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