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Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

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Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#101

Post by chrisrogers »

coldtea wrote: post #89
mhurron wrote: post #3

“We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” This is my position on the Olympics and basically all national pride. It has nothing to do with anything, there is nothing to be proud of. No one cares when I think it, it's nice to see others say it.

> “We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” Well, this is obviously wrong. Birth is not just a random momentary thing. It involves your parents. And they already had a nationality too. You couldn't have been born by any two random other people and still be the same person (DNA, childhood raising, education, food, native language, et al). Second, you is not your birth only. It's al…

Identity in total is obviously more gray than the one sentence can provide, but its sentiment is important. And that's all it obviously is -- sentiment -- not a statement of fact.

The world is an awfully large place, but its cultures are more widely distributed than ever before. Therefore a citizen has much better opportunity to form a morality or philosophy that is independent of the place they live. That is the sentiment, free and able to join your other points of cultural context.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#102

Post by sremani »

mastersk3 wrote: post #33

Time and time again I wonder if i should laugh at the absurdity of such articles this or worry about the excessive, obsessive usage of the word Indian.

Indian - the closest thing to that word is European. We do not speak the same language, eat the same food, our culture is as diverse as that of Europe - but the fake homogeneity the word Indian brings bother me a lot.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#103

Post by pessimizer »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #93
pessimizer wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>silly to argue that dedication, concentration, work ethic, attitude, family support are not cultural. No, it's silly to argue that they are. You've exclusively mentioned virtues that are as common to every culture as they are to every grouping of humans that hasn't been designed intentionally to exclude them. Culture largely consists of meals, hairstyles and clothing, dancing and mating habits, religion and racism,…

That's a very narrow view of culture, and wrong. Culture in some PC sense might be defined as only those things that are cute. But peoples differ greatly in important ways. There are real differences in family support, work ethic, dedication. Sorry if that seems offensive.

>Sorry if that seems offensive.

It seems groundless and silly, rather than offensive. Examples of cultures that lack family support, a work ethic, concentration, or dedication would make your case.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#104

Post by mindcrime »

coldtea wrote: post #89
mhurron wrote: post #3

“We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” This is my position on the Olympics and basically all national pride. It has nothing to do with anything, there is nothing to be proud of. No one cares when I think it, it's nice to see others say it.

> “We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” Well, this is obviously wrong. Birth is not just a random momentary thing. It involves your parents. And they already had a nationality too. You couldn't have been born by any two random other people and still be the same person (DNA, childhood raising, education, food, native language, et al). Second, you is not your birth only. It's al…

Well, this is obviously wrong.

Well, despite how obvious it is to you, you totally failed to convince me.

Home country in danger? "Fuck it, I'll just flee. After all, it's only me, me, me that matters"

Yes, and? Nationalism is the problem, not the solution. Oh, I understand the reasons articulated by the evolutionary psychologists for why humans are cliquish and tribal, and that all makes perfect sense. But we have the capacity for logic and higher order reasoning and we can transcend primal instincts like that if we want. And I think we should.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#105

Post by talmand »

dharmach wrote: post #50
mhurron wrote: post #3

“We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” This is my position on the Olympics and basically all national pride. It has nothing to do with anything, there is nothing to be proud of. No one cares when I think it, it's nice to see others say it.

Though one's nationality may be an accident and one can understand the futility of the pride, how can one ignore the way world treats people based on their nationality?

I agree, based on my experience many of the people who downplay nationality as something significant are among the first to judge an entire group based on nothing but nationality.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#106

Post by cloverich »

dasil003 wrote: post #76
tobiasu wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was he, per chance, invaded by a nation that loved its nationalism uber alles? A nation that was only recently unified from many tribes, and whose politicians longing for a great nation resulted in 50-70 million dead? No thanks. Nationality is whose warlords turf you are born on. The second we get over this concept, the world will be a better place.

> The second we get over this concept, the world will be a better place. Thus paving the way for our multinational corporate overlords to consolidate control. Personally I am very scared for the type of global corruption that will be possible without national boundaries.

As opposed to the national corruption that lends itself to global warfare, genocide, and nuclear warfare? I don't see it as good, nor do I see it as inherently worse.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#107

Post by castis »

coldtea wrote: post #89
mhurron wrote: post #3

“We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” This is my position on the Olympics and basically all national pride. It has nothing to do with anything, there is nothing to be proud of. No one cares when I think it, it's nice to see others say it.

> “We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” Well, this is obviously wrong. Birth is not just a random momentary thing. It involves your parents. And they already had a nationality too. You couldn't have been born by any two random other people and still be the same person (DNA, childhood raising, education, food, native language, et al). Second, you is not your birth only. It's al…

You can write all you want, but outright nullifying someones argument with "Well, this is obviously wrong." immediately inspires resentment and you've already lost their interest.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#108

Post by pavs »

r0h1n wrote: post #85
_nedR wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"99 percent of Indian aspirants to get admissions even to an IIT or IIM, but it is far simpler to get into an Ivy League institution. If you don’t get into an IIM, you try Harvard." It is not all that hard to get into an IIM these days actually. IIT is definitely hard at the Undergraduate level (and harder than any US institution) primarily due to the sheer number of students trying to get in. The coursework is also…

> It is not all that hard to get into an IIM these days actually. Last year 1,73,735 candidates took the CAT admission test through which the IIMs admit 3,335 MBA students. That's a 1:52 ratio. Now you could argue that not everyone who takes the CAT is an IIM applicant. So let's take IIM Ahmedabad's (slightly dated) data for 2006-08 admission [1]. Of the 1,44,027 who applied to the institute, 273 secured an admission…

I can't help but notice you guys are ignoring the fact that india has a huge population. In the context of indian population does this numbers really look that impressive? Doesn't it also mean that there are not enough highly sought after institutions like IIM or IIT?

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#109

Post by mattlutze »

coldtea wrote: post #89
mhurron wrote: post #3

“We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” This is my position on the Olympics and basically all national pride. It has nothing to do with anything, there is nothing to be proud of. No one cares when I think it, it's nice to see others say it.

> “We are all human beings, and our nationality is simply an accident of birth.” Well, this is obviously wrong. Birth is not just a random momentary thing. It involves your parents. And they already had a nationality too. You couldn't have been born by any two random other people and still be the same person (DNA, childhood raising, education, food, native language, et al). Second, you is not your birth only. It's al…

> "It's basically just an excuse to feel independent and non-connected and owning solidarity to anyone."

This is particularly important. In a growing culture of "independent connectedness" it is so very easy to forget both the historical importance of a community on the individual, as well as reduce the individual's compulsion to benevolence toward members of that society.

Our communities are in part a reflection of our national consciousness, and we'd do well to remember that we are a part of those communities.

Re: Nadella as Microsoft CEO: A slap in the face for Indian system

#110

Post by ben336 »

argumentum wrote: post #14

The biggest mistake here is assuming these people wouldn't succeed in India or anywhere else. The IIT & IIM people move here to the US because they are an approximation of "the best" in India. Others come as well, the best doctors have nothing to do with IIT and IIM obviously. The best people are going to succeed nearly anywhere. Obviously Nazi Germany is an exception w/regards to the Jews & others they targeted. But…

> Obviously Nazi Germany is an exception

Thats the only exception you can think of?

> The USA has been the prime beneficiary throughout history

For values of history starting later than the late 1700s :)

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