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The problem for Google which might cost them 1 Billion is that they say that all sales to french customers are done in Ireland but in the same time Google has 100+ employees in france whith title like "sales manager" who talks about theirs "clients" in internal emails.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Personally, I'm in favour of taxing Internet companies Why? EDIT: I was just curious to hear more.
Why you saying Why should Internet companies be taxed? Or Why should taxes exist at all?
Because all other companies are being taxed when offering products or services to citizens of the given country, within the legislation of that country. Certain Internet companies use questionable tax planning strategies (in Europe as well as the US) to pay a ridiculously small amount of taxes and thus gaining an unfair advantage.
> Or Why should taxes exist at all?
Because running a country costs money which is required to provide services such as law enforcement and a regulated banking system. These services are required by citizens and corporations alike.
But going further down this argument is obviously not in the scope of this discussion thread and will not end up being a fruitful conversation. We're talking about a small-ish change to the tax system rather than a full blown anarchist revolution here.
I had to kind of laugh at the seeming distress expressed in the article the Google merely passed on the taxes to the consumer, as in who do politicians and journalist think pay all taxes? Business taxes are merely an indirect means of taxation on the populace, it is done to fool the general population into believing someone else carries the load.
Can you elaborate? how google being taxed has an impact on my own income?
I had to kind of laugh at the seeming distress expressed in the article the Google merely passed on the taxes to the consumer, as in who do politicians and journalist think pay all taxes? Business taxes are merely an indirect means of taxation on the populace, it is done to fool the general population into believing someone else carries the load.
Can you elaborate? how google being taxed has an impact on my own income?
On one extreme, Google keeps it's prices static and it's customers don't change their buy resulting in the tax coming only out of Google's profit.
On the other extreme, Google raises it's prices exactly proportional to the tax, it's customers buy the same amount of ads and raise their prices exactly proportional to the increase and you pay them for service or good $x. Your income stays the same but it buys less because everything is more expensive.
The real result is in the middle, google eats some of the loss from tax, raises it's prices and customers somewhat lower their ad spend and somewhat raise their own prices eating some of the loss from tax. Which extreme any individual believes is more accurate has more to do with political bias than truth.
The problem for Google which might cost them 1 Billion is that they say that all sales to french customers are done in Ireland but in the same time Google has 100+ employees in france whith title like "sales manager" who talks about theirs "clients" in internal emails.
I don't think that is true.
Realising this was a mistake everything was renamed in 2011, apparently.
The answer is "no". Disclaimer: I'm French.
The fact that you are french does not make your opinion meaningfull without any explanation on why you disagree with this tax. Please, explain us why or do not leave this kind of comments.
If France alone stands up for this one, it's meaningless because they'll find a loop (or carry on with the Double Irish and Dutch sandwich) and we'll just look like communist heaven (hyperbole) while not reaping anything.
We need to do it at the EU level, with a law which overrules local business taxations settings if the company is owned by a non EU entity.
Of course, the only way to push for it is to have champion country doing the dirty work, so I guess we're stuck with that.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
So the solution is for .nl and .ie to close their loopholes, not create new taxes, no? They recently passed a similar tax in Italy, and the whole thing was about how the big bad American companies are making money and not investing in Italy. This, at the same time Fiat is decamping from Italy because the business climate is so shitty. So what's their creative answer to improve things? Another tax!
So the solution is for .nl and .ie to close their loopholes, not create new taxes, no? .ie is the loophole, most of the time.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I believe tackling such a complex issue affecting many countries on a national level is a mistake. This sounds like the main problem here, to me: EU law makes it easy for a company to do business anywhere in EU and only pay taxes in its headquarters, on the assumption that it doesn't matter a lot where the company pays its taxes as long as it's inside the EU. But at the same time, EU law doesn't regulate corporate…
> so some countries can easily take advantage of that by lowering them (or completely removing them) so companies will be attracted there. God forbid anyone try and make a country a good place to do business. I'm for closing the various loopholes, because big companies should have to pay the same taxes that smaller companies do. But I am also very much in favor or countries trying to compete and improve in order to a…
You are taking this the wrong way. It's not that Ireland does not want to import corporate tax from France and Italy, it is that they substantially lowered it, expressly to take advantage of the other EU countries.
You can also see that I didn't advocate higher taxes for Ireland or lower taxes for the rest of EU, since it doesn't actually matter as long as they are the same in all EU.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> so some countries can easily take advantage of that by lowering them (or completely removing them) so companies will be attracted there. God forbid anyone try and make a country a good place to do business. I'm for closing the various loopholes, because big companies should have to pay the same taxes that smaller companies do. But I am also very much in favor or countries trying to compete and improve in order to a…
> You call other countries who don't want to import the crappy, unfriendly business climate of countries like France or Italy (where I live) "parasites". You are taking this the wrong way. It's not that Ireland does not want to import corporate tax from France and Italy, it is that they substantially lowered it, expressly to take advantage of the other EU countries. You can also see that I didn't advocate higher taxe…
Good. That's called competition. They want to attract companies to their country. There are plenty of things Ireland can't compete on, like having a decent climate (IMO), so they do what they can.
> You can also see that I didn't advocate higher taxes for Ireland or lower taxes for the rest of EU, since it doesn't actually matter as long as they are the same in all EU.
Then why doesn't France lower theirs? "Harmonization" is just a way of saying "they should raise their taxes".
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> You call other countries who don't want to import the crappy, unfriendly business climate of countries like France or Italy (where I live) "parasites". You are taking this the wrong way. It's not that Ireland does not want to import corporate tax from France and Italy, it is that they substantially lowered it, expressly to take advantage of the other EU countries. You can also see that I didn't advocate higher taxe…
> It's not that Ireland does not want to import corporate tax from France and Italy, it is that they substantially lowered it, expressly to take advantage of the other EU countries. Good. That's called competition. They want to attract companies to their country. There are plenty of things Ireland can't compete on, like having a decent climate (IMO), so they do what they can. > You can also see that I didn't advocate…
I believe competition has no place, or should have no place, between EU countries. But that's my personnal opinion, which seems less and less shared accross Europe.
> Then why doesn't France lower theirs? "Harmonization" is just a way of saying "they should raise their taxes".
Huh, I'm not part of the Ministry of Finance, so I don't think I have to justify myself for France not lowering their taxes, but it's probably because France is more dependant now on corporate tax than Ireland was when they decided to lower them (France still has some kind of industry, while Ireland didn't then). It's not up to France (or Ireland) alone to make a decision to have the same taxes all accross EU anyway.
Harmonization means levelling taxes accross the EU, I didn't say a single word on how they should be raised. You are reading way too much in my words.
Edit: formatting (and the bit about how the EU is more than just France+Ireland).