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Revolution in Kiev

zyalt.livejournal.com

341–350 of 377 posts

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#341
post #280
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FYI, Baltic states and ex-ussr-satellites are doing great in EU. Sure we still got a long way to go. But current state is good enough. Well, at least 10x better than Ukraine, Belorussia and other ex-ussr states that stayed together with Russia. Many Russians/Ukrainians/Belorussians come to ex-ussr-now-eu for shopping and medical procedures. Why? Stuff is cheaper and better quality here in Lithuania. And salaries are…

You should ask not only your friends and relatives, but all people all around, forming the proper representation. For example, you haven't asked farmers about changes that came to them. Or industrial workers. I almost certain about that.

This is getting dangerously close to "no true scotsman".

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#342
post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had no problems sending and receiving mail packages 10 years ago. I am 42, BTW.

1 I dislike very much the fact of being dragged into a discussion of this kind. Problems of Russian Mail are universally known. 2 Circa 2004 two my parcels arrived to different post offices late and cut open. There was no valuables inside (I wasn't that naive.) Ever since I used express services (DHL, TNT, PE) 3 I heard similar stories from other people (late&open) 4 Recently I received two packages by Russian Mail.…

1 You started that. They started not long time ago, you can see an onset of jokes about Russian Post Service on the popular jokes site bash.im (former bash.org.ru). This onset started about two or three years ago.

2 Me and my friends and relatives had not have problems at the same time.

7 I can cite you horror stories about everything. 20 steps to eat potato and not get screwed. I think you also heard about selection bias, do you?

10 I think you had to start with YMMV instead of ending with it. Because, you know, for every anecdote you tell I have another anecdote to tell you.

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#343
post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should ask not only your friends and relatives, but all people all around, forming the proper representation. For example, you haven't asked farmers about changes that came to them. Or industrial workers. I almost certain about that.

This is getting dangerously close to "no true scotsman".

I believe that yours gets dangerously close to Godwin's.

I had in mind that relying only to "statistics" from close friends and relatives skews one's view SO MUCH that one should not even apply that argument in almost any discussion.

You either try to get the whole picture of life or live in the sweet bubble.

The bubble had its own good properties - less mind energy expended, you can focus on what entertains you most. But that about all. To plan your journey through life you have to have the complete picture, or, at least, try to acquire it.

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#344
post #340
post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is more a reminder that those who most seek to overthrow what they perceive to be the current oppressors are the most likely to end up being the future oppressors Precisely. This is why I'm no fan of revolutions. > Society needs a response against this minority, and this response needs to be organized somehow If I hire a protection/defense agency to guard against those who wish to rule me, this agency only has a…

"and trust me, there will be plenty willing to have my money and do a better job" See this is the bit I don't understand, my understanding of market forces is that those that do the job better will grow if they are in anyway scalable. Now your in a position were small protection rings are unable to work against there large competitors. Similar to how you say you can't compete against government in the supply of defen…

Two or more big firms are better than having one violent monopoly. Furthermore, if people are well aware those are actually firms, it becomes very hard for those firms to bullshit people into obedience. Extortion wouldn't be called taxation, it would be called extortion and everyone will be able to see that. War wouldn't be called war, but would be called murder. And most likely people would rebel against that. So, if I was this businessman running a protection agency, what do you think would I do: risk losing my business and possibly being killed by an angry mob or steady profit and serving my customers well?

Truth is, governments are only able to run this charade because of the combination of power and brainwashing. Take one component away and it's gone.

Of course you might say "but people are so easily brainwashed, of course those firms are gonna be able to do it and convince people that them being de-facto government is a great thing". Well, ask yourself, these days, how many people can you convince that slavery is a good idea?

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please elaborate on this: "conclusion is based on experience of former Baltic USSR republics". I am from a former Baltic USSR republic and I have no idea how you came up with your, as you might say, stupid conclusion. It is just plain not true.

thesz is from Moscow, it's how it looks from there.

It should look to you too. Try to investigate.

Look no further than to Forbes: http://www.forbes.com/sites/markadomanis/2013/12/26/bulgaria...

The power of propaganda, you say?

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#346
post #340
post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is more a reminder that those who most seek to overthrow what they perceive to be the current oppressors are the most likely to end up being the future oppressors Precisely. This is why I'm no fan of revolutions. > Society needs a response against this minority, and this response needs to be organized somehow If I hire a protection/defense agency to guard against those who wish to rule me, this agency only has a…

"and trust me, there will be plenty willing to have my money and do a better job" See this is the bit I don't understand, my understanding of market forces is that those that do the job better will grow if they are in anyway scalable. Now your in a position were small protection rings are unable to work against there large competitors. Similar to how you say you can't compete against government in the supply of defen…

Also, note that firms cannot grow indefinitely, enormous corporations we see today are actually products of this governmental system, in which they bribe government for regulations and deny competitors opportunities.

A great example of a market force that prevented an entity from growing is a recent Bitcoin incident in which one hashing pool was close to 51% of hashing power, which would give it an ability to double spend or otherwise compromise the network. So people simply spread awareness and many withdrew from this pool, effectively lowering its market share. What makes you think this is impossible with other businesses?

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#347
post #344
post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"and trust me, there will be plenty willing to have my money and do a better job" See this is the bit I don't understand, my understanding of market forces is that those that do the job better will grow if they are in anyway scalable. Now your in a position were small protection rings are unable to work against there large competitors. Similar to how you say you can't compete against government in the supply of defen…

Two or more big firms are better than having one violent monopoly. Furthermore, if people are well aware those are actually firms, it becomes very hard for those firms to bullshit people into obedience. Extortion wouldn't be called taxation, it would be called extortion and everyone will be able to see that. War wouldn't be called war, but would be called murder. And most likely people would rebel against that. So, i…

But you seem to be unhappy with the current system of the hundred or more big firms and are advocating disbanding these current governments and switching from this to even smaller firms. I'm confused because I believe this will naturally lead to these firms growing into larger firms with no oversight by the public at large and thus eventually give you even fewer options.

As to what it's called; the extortion would be called a compulsory service fee, war would be called large scale protective operations. What people call it privately isn't a problem until the point at which the extortion is costing them more than they think they can save by revolting.

As to why would the business do this? Because they can make more money doing this and it's not illegal because they are the law. They do not care about the good will of the customer, because the extra cost to the customer is not enough for the customer to act on. Prices are set to what the market will pay, in this case it's as close to revolt as the business can get away with.

I would also like to point out that I don't disagree with your assertion that their are negatives with a government controlled monopoly on law enforcement, I disagree with the idea that a free market system for it would not be subject to worse corruption/abuse.

Well, ask yourself, these days, how many people can you convince that bullying is a good idea? Just because an idea is not something that you would choose if you're enlightened, does not mean that people will not backslide into it.

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#348
post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is getting dangerously close to "no true scotsman".

I believe that yours gets dangerously close to Godwin's. I had in mind that relying only to "statistics" from close friends and relatives skews one's view SO MUCH that one should not even apply that argument in almost any discussion. You either try to get the whole picture of life or live in the sweet bubble. The bubble had its own good properties - less mind energy expended, you can focus on what entertains you most…

Please elaborate your Godwin accusation, and explain, in what way you believe that I lack a complete picture. I am fully aware, FYI, that there exists a 30-50% Russian minority in Ukraine (with exact percentage depending on whether you count by ethnicity or by native language).

In addition, please explain how it is that the "friends and family" whose opinions you so adamantly declare are irrelevant are also living in bubbles. Are millions of people living in bubbles? Thousands? Dozens? Just me? How many exactly? I would like to hear your answer.

Or is it, perhaps, only people you don't agree with who live in "bubbles"?

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#349
post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 I dislike very much the fact of being dragged into a discussion of this kind. Problems of Russian Mail are universally known. 2 Circa 2004 two my parcels arrived to different post offices late and cut open. There was no valuables inside (I wasn't that naive.) Ever since I used express services (DHL, TNT, PE) 3 I heard similar stories from other people (late&open) 4 Recently I received two packages by Russian Mail.…

1 You started that. They started not long time ago, you can see an onset of jokes about Russian Post Service on the popular jokes site bash.im (former bash.org.ru). This onset started about two or three years ago. 2 Me and my friends and relatives had not have problems at the same time. 7 I can cite you horror stories about everything. 20 steps to eat potato and not get screwed. I think you also heard about selection…

[deleted]

Re: Revolution in Kiev

#350
post #346
post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"and trust me, there will be plenty willing to have my money and do a better job" See this is the bit I don't understand, my understanding of market forces is that those that do the job better will grow if they are in anyway scalable. Now your in a position were small protection rings are unable to work against there large competitors. Similar to how you say you can't compete against government in the supply of defen…

Also, note that firms cannot grow indefinitely, enormous corporations we see today are actually products of this governmental system, in which they bribe government for regulations and deny competitors opportunities. A great example of a market force that prevented an entity from growing is a recent Bitcoin incident in which one hashing pool was close to 51% of hashing power, which would give it an ability to double…

I understand that they cannot grow indefinitely but being the sole survivor in a city is not far fetched. Ofcourse the higher income with less service in that city gives them additional funds to operate in other cities.

As to your second point nothing makes me think it's impossible when people are paying attention to the business. But I believe that apathy is a large factor. Not only that but in this unregulated world how would you even know that this business has enough of the market to be a threat. Why would you change to a worse service if you only suspect they're getting a bit big and it has real financial or service impacts for you. You in turn need to pass on to your customers these impacts making your business less appealing even though your competitor isn't.

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