Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
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Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#2I'd say it was cowardly and poor leadership for Obama to get this report and still half-step his speech, if not anti-democratic. There's something he won't tell us.
Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#3Brand also worried that declaring that counterterrorism officials “have been operating this program unlawfully for years” could damage morale and make agencies overly cautious in taking steps to protect the country.
It's great to have another voice speaking up against mass surveillance. Still -- you're telling me these agencies are in all likelihood committing crimes against the American people, but we need to be careful not to hurt their feelings?
Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#4I'd say it was cowardly and poor leadership for Obama to get this report and still half-step his speech, if not anti-democratic. There's something he won't tell us.
Somewhere there's a bunch of people thinking "at least that's all that's been leaked".
Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#5Brand also worried that declaring that counterterrorism officials “have been operating this program unlawfully for years” could damage morale and make agencies overly cautious in taking steps to protect the country. It's great to have another voice speaking up against mass surveillance. Still -- you're telling me these agencies are in all likelihood committing crimes against the American people, but we need to be car…
> But you're telling me these agencies are committing a crime against the American people, and we need to be careful not to hurt their feelings?
Its worse than that: we have to be careful to avoid making them cautious about committing crimes against the American people, the rule of law, and the Constitutional order of government.
Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#6Brand also worried that declaring that counterterrorism officials “have been operating this program unlawfully for years” could damage morale and make agencies overly cautious in taking steps to protect the country. It's great to have another voice speaking up against mass surveillance. Still -- you're telling me these agencies are in all likelihood committing crimes against the American people, but we need to be car…
Well, it makes sense that she'd say that since she's one of the two that rejected that the program is illegal.
I've been reading Tim Weiner's Enemies, a history of the FBI and one thing stuck with me. That was that there was a period of time when the FBI was incredibly useless because of a previous Supreme Court ruling that wiretapping was illegal and then FBI agents all began to misunderstand what they could and couldn't do. That lead to a breakdown in communication and procedure between different offices and several terrorists that could have been caught slipped by.
I'm not saying that Brand is right, but there is reason to worry that this could happen again. What needs to be done is a clear declaration of our fundamental rights and a watchdog court that won't let the agencies overstep in their pursuit of justice. The agents have to know their boundaries, we have to know their boundaries, and we have to know that they know their boundaries. The whole FISA court stuff is ridiculous.
Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#7According to the article, three out of five members of the board held the opinion the program was illegal. That's a little bit different than what the title of the article suggests.
Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#8Brand also worried that declaring that counterterrorism officials “have been operating this program unlawfully for years” could damage morale and make agencies overly cautious in taking steps to protect the country. It's great to have another voice speaking up against mass surveillance. Still -- you're telling me these agencies are in all likelihood committing crimes against the American people, but we need to be car…
They're not committing crimes against the American people. Not one American has been found who has been demonstrably harmed by any NSA program. Without harm, there no criminal act. That said, something can be unlawful without being criminal.
Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#9Brand also worried that declaring that counterterrorism officials “have been operating this program unlawfully for years” could damage morale and make agencies overly cautious in taking steps to protect the country. It's great to have another voice speaking up against mass surveillance. Still -- you're telling me these agencies are in all likelihood committing crimes against the American people, but we need to be car…
They're not committing crimes against the American people. Not one American has been found who has been demonstrably harmed by any NSA program. Without harm, there no criminal act. That said, something can be unlawful without being criminal.
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Re: Watchdog Report Says N.S.A. Program Is Illegal and Should End
#10Brand also worried that declaring that counterterrorism officials “have been operating this program unlawfully for years” could damage morale and make agencies overly cautious in taking steps to protect the country. It's great to have another voice speaking up against mass surveillance. Still -- you're telling me these agencies are in all likelihood committing crimes against the American people, but we need to be car…
Well, it makes sense that she'd say that since she's one of the two that rejected that the program is illegal. I've been reading Tim Weiner's Enemies, a history of the FBI and one thing stuck with me. That was that there was a period of time when the FBI was incredibly useless because of a previous Supreme Court ruling that wiretapping was illegal and then FBI agents all began to misunderstand what they could and cou…
It would be wonderful if all wiretaps were ruled illegal.
It would also be wonderful if all law enforcement officers were required to wear uniforms or identify themselves when in the course of their duties.